Post by: TheIronMaiden on September 09, 2003, 10:32:31 pm
I wanted to add in a little of my opinion on the whole homosexuality thing.
I personally don't see anything wrong with homosexuality. I believe that people are born straight, gay, or bi and that what they do is there own business. I think Jon Stewart of The Daily Show said it rather well when he said,
"I'm a little worried about this gay marriage thing. I mean, is the government going to make us marry gay? That's what I think it is, and here is the reason why. If the government isn't going to force people to make man-love, then why is it anyone's business?"
This is true, because it isn't anyone's business who someone is in love with. I don't see the reason why people find it so necessary to regulate what occurs inside people's bedrooms.
Some people I know don't seem to see it that way though. About two years ago, I found out one of my friends was (this will be a switch) a homophobe. He, three of my other friends, and I were sitting in orchestra on a kind of off day and just talking. One of my friends started talking about how he had a couple of friends who were gay, and my friend said "If I ever found out that any of you were gay, I would beat the crap out of you." So then the one who had been talking before asked if he was a homophobe and he said yes. The other one asked how he felt about bi people and he said that that was just as bad. Now, I was just in total shock. I had never been around a homophobe before, and hearing someone that I've known and considered a friend for three and a half years just come out and say something like that, just completely caught me off guard. I lost A LOT of respect for him that day. I personally kind of have my doubts that he would go through with the threat he made though. In all the years I've known him (including the years after that conversation) I've only seen him hit someone one time. That one person was me. In orchestra in middle school I was being annoying and he got angry and punched me one time in the side of my hipbone. Also, last year, he seemed to not be so bad on the subject. He might shudder when someone said something about homosexuals, but he never made any other threats or said anything bad about them. I still consider him a friend (I don't really see him all that often since we don't have any of the same classes this year), but if I ever heard of him making fun of or laying a hand on somebody because they were gay or bi, I would drop him from my list of friends in an instant. I do not tolerate people that hurt others for no reason, and if he hadn't been a friend of mine for so long, I would have severed my friendship with him the second he had uttered that original statement. Please do not misconstrue my maintaining a friendship with him as an acceptance of homophobia.
There was one other instance that occurred just a couple weeks ago. I'm a liberal and I live in a liberal state, but the community I live in is conservative. I was in my government class, and this one conservative girl overheard me say I was liberal. She asked if I was for gay marriage and I said, "Yes, what people want to do isn't my business". She then stated a gigantic piece of bs about "It is our business, because they live in our society and it reflects badly on us." I couldn't even speak when I heard that. All I could do was stare at her and think "You arrogant, presumptuous, ignorant, sanctimonious, egotistical twit. How dare you put yourself on some high and mighty pedestal over other people based on one small insignificant fact that doesn't affect you whatsoever and doesn’t change the value of a person in the slightest."
I don't know, I would like to think narrow-minded views would go away in the future, and hopefully they will, but never underestimate the power of ignorance in the human species.
Sorry, if that went on a little long, I just needed to get some of that out, some people make me angry.
Post by: Russano Greenstripe on December 29, 2003, 12:35:36 am
| Quote (Raef Wolfe @ Dec. 26 2003, 7:14 pm) |
| I don't think he meant roleplaying, Ursan, I think he meant the people playing them. Could be wrong, but that's the impression I got. *shrugs* |
Raef's right. I was talking about games like Dark Age of Camelot, Phantasy Star Online, and SOCOM: US Navy Seals. Though I'm not logged on one, I suppose there's people of all three kinds on those kinda games.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on September 09, 2003, 04:14:42 pm
Post by: Sunookitsune on September 04, 2003, 05:12:34 pm
*hugs Bear Paw*
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on September 04, 2003, 05:11:20 pm
| Quote (Bear Paw @ Sep. 03 2003, 7:08 pm) |
| *Bear creeps in behind them all springs up and get's em all in an extra big bear hug. * Hahah got the lot of ya.... oops erm did anyone else here a cracking sound. I think im gonna put ya all down now I don't think blues a good colour for a person to be never mind a furry (unless your blue anyway that is  ) |
Thanks! I don't need to go to the chiropractor now, your hug just adjusted my back.
Drake
Post by: River Ceed on August 05, 2003, 11:54:02 am
Insert tab b into slot a can be modified many ways. People find a way of showing affection regardless of appendange limits. Perhaps if more people looked at the soul instead of anatomy when trying to find a date, relationships would last longer.
Blessings,
River
Post by: Rikimaru on September 04, 2003, 03:42:55 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on September 04, 2003, 03:45:28 pm
Well I'm not broken.
*wheu*
but then I like hugs
*hugs the bear back*
Post by: Benjamin on September 04, 2003, 03:00:41 am
I think you broke 'em, Bear Paw.
Well, you know the rules...
You break 'em, you buy 'em!
Benjamin
Post by: zackary_rainheart on August 25, 2003, 05:14:16 pm
| Quote (Benjamin @ Aug. 20 2003, 5:49 pm) | ||
So which is it? The 3 or the 4? Or are you definitely indefinite? Benjamin |
For Sake of ending the confusion.. lets just say he is a 3.5
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on August 25, 2003, 05:47:10 pm
| Quote (zackary_rainheart @ Aug. 25 2003, 5:14 pm) | ||||
For Sake of ending the confusion.. lets just say he is a 3.5 |
*wolf feebly raises his paw* I'm a Kinsey 1 with a taste for females that are cat-like. It's a yin/yang thing.
Post by: Bear Paw on August 05, 2003, 07:01:11 pm
Post by: Zero on December 28, 2003, 05:33:17 pm
Post by: Yip on August 05, 2003, 04:30:42 pm
Now down to the apples. Yes apples. Lets say someone who has never tasted an apple before tries one for the first time. Say they didn't like the apple. They would probably conclude that they do not like apples. Yes apples. They would apply what little knowledge they have over the whole group. This is a very natural way to think, but it can often lead us to form opinions that are flawed. What if that someone had gotten a hold of a bad apple? Or maybe they just don't like that type of apple. (Myself I like the green crunchy ones. I don't really like 'em when they get smooshy) Even if they try several apples and find they don't like them there is still a chance there is kind of apple they do like. That is, they still may not have an accurate idea about the whole group. It is for this reason that I try not to rely too heavily on this way of thinking. Though it is nearly impossible to avoid completely, I think we should at least accept the possibility that we may be wrong about some things. And when we speak of a group, we should try to realize how much of the group we are really talking about and what consequences there are in including the parts that may not apply. This is a code I try to live by, though without all the apples
.Does this relate to the topic? Actually I think it relates to this and many other topics. It's something to keep in mind always. You see, I hate to see any group unfairly judged based on part of the group. (And I'm not talking about any specific group here. I mean this in a global sence.) Even though I know I myself am probably guilty of it as well. But I do try to avoid such things. (I do recognize the possibility that there may be smooshy apples that I would like.)
Hopefully, I haven't let the apples get in the way of what I was saying.
Post by: Perimus on September 10, 2003, 12:47:44 am
Thanks for your opinion, Iron Maiden. Sometimes, having to listen to all the anti-gay rights crap that is going on, it's easy to forget that there are straight people out there with a sane head on their shoulders, and who don't wish us gays would just disappear.
This country may be about freedom, but lots of people seem to think that only means freedom to force others to think and be the way that only they approve of.
I have hope that when my generation is controlling our government, several years down the road, things will be much better.
Post by: Benjamin on June 06, 2003, 08:51:37 pm
| Quote (Drake Blackpaw @ June 06 2003, 7:49 pm) |
| With as many heterosexuals that bash and torment homosexuals, isn't it naive to expect the whole homosexual community and even the subset that is part of furry to welcome heterosexuals with open arms. |
Most homophobia is based on ignorance, whereas heterophobia (if that's a word) is often more like a form of vengance. I'm not trying to put a rationale to homophobia, but I'm reminding people that there are people that are heterophobic, on the other side of the coin. Both types of people are the sorts that I generally prefer to avoid.
Basically, I can't tolerate intolerant people like that.
Benjamin
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 06, 2003, 08:56:35 pm
| Quote (Benjamin @ June 06 2003, 8:51 pm) |
| Both types of people are the sorts that I generally prefer to avoid. Basically, I can't tolerate intolerant people like that. |
I'm in 100% agreement with you there!
Drake
Post by: Job on January 29, 2003, 11:46:39 pm
Post by: Benjamin on January 30, 2003, 12:09:05 am
Oh, and welcome to the furtopia.org forums.
Benjamin
Post by: Job on January 30, 2003, 05:29:28 pm
Post by: Kada-Ru on January 30, 2003, 05:35:05 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on January 30, 2003, 06:20:44 pm
Also I think that most people are Bi, just to different amounts.
Just my thoughts, don't bite me for them.
Chaz
Post by: Benjamin on January 30, 2003, 06:32:30 pm
I roleplay online using a gay character or two, but in the real world, I find I have no interest in having a same sex relationship (believe me, I tried), so I voted 'straight' in this poll... since that's the most accurate for me.
Benjamin
Post by: Chaz_wolf on January 30, 2003, 06:47:56 pm
Chaz
Post by: Jadnar on January 31, 2003, 02:56:49 pm
Post by: Job on January 31, 2003, 03:21:10 pm
funny faces
Post by: Vergil on January 31, 2003, 09:15:39 pm
Post by: Benjamin on January 31, 2003, 09:46:08 pm
Heheh...
Well, I'm watching this poll with interest. The results so far are close to what I figured the way things went with this fandom. Still too few have voted, though.
Benjamin
Post by: on January 31, 2003, 10:11:23 pm
Since I'm planning on staying a virgin for the rest of my life (and have many reasons to do so), would that make me bisexual or not applicable?
Post by: Benjamin on January 31, 2003, 10:14:04 pm
There is the 'fourth' unwritten option of being 'nonsexual', aka asexual, celibate, and stuff like that.
Benjamin
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 01, 2003, 06:31:34 am
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 01, 2003, 03:59:04 pm
This is going alot like I expected it too.. I think the reasion most people think furries are gay is becouse furries tend not to hide it so much. We are more open in alot of things.. like S+M too.. rembering a new furrs reaction to the AC noticeboard last year.
Well just my thoughts
Chaz
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 01, 2003, 05:20:20 pm
Post by: Jadnar on February 01, 2003, 05:41:15 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 01, 2003, 08:51:06 pm
DrakonianDanceR, your pont is very well made too.
Human socitiy is like sheep.. they all have to fit into the coman group and anything new they react very badly to.
Becouse furs are more open and less quick to judge / react we get along better with each other. And we can trust each other more.
Jadnar, I got the same reaction from one of my friends when I mention gay sex one time.. but then a week later I walked in on him having sex with one of my other male frends.. he had tried to hide the fact he was gay becouse he thought he was supposed to hide it and act the way he did.
Sad that human socity forces people to act this way.
Another thought, if you are looking for your mate / soulmate etc.. why cut your chances by 50% and discount half or more of the people you meet just becouse of there sex ?
Anyways. enough of my ramblings.
Take care all
Chaz
Post by: Benjamin on February 02, 2003, 03:37:23 am
Furs preach tolerance all the time, but there are many preachers out there that don't follow their own words. I've seen this sort of thing happen time and time again in certain circles in this fandom, and it's a bit disheartening.
Furs aren't immune to the "us and them" attitude to that most will accuse non-furs of possessing. Furs are, after all, human... or at least partially so.
| Quote |
| Another thought, if you are looking for your mate / soulmate etc.. why cut your chances by 50% and discount half or more of the people you meet just becouse of there sex ? |
Not everyone can get sexually aroused or fall in love with someone of the same sex, or even the opposite sex for that matter. Society has a lot of impact in how someone leads their lives, but there's also (apparently, or so the scientists say) some biological factors in that sort of decision. Some of us can safely say that we tried "playing for the other team" and it didn't do a thing for us.
Benjamin
Post by: Ariela on February 02, 2003, 04:00:18 am
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 02, 2003, 01:53:35 pm
Post by: Job on February 02, 2003, 02:09:38 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 06, 2003, 07:49:45 pm
| Quote (Benjamin @ June 06 2003, 1:03 am) |
| I dunno. I've seen plenty of "heterophobic" behavior amongst some furry groups. |
I've only been in the community a short time, but I've run into more homosexuals who are openly accepting of hetrosexuals than ones who shun us.
With as many heterosexuals that bash and torment homosexuals, isn't it naive to expect the whole homosexual community and even the subset that is part of furry to welcome heterosexuals with open arms.
I'm just happy that so many of us get along and care deeply about each other regardless of sexual orientation. That some can't from either side is sad, but shouldn't take away from high level of acceptance that exists here.
Drake
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 02, 2003, 02:25:32 pm
| Quote (Job @ Feb. 02 2003, 7:09 pm) |
| Yes, it is odd to see complete strangers talking openly about this sort of thing, but it is getting more common, along with the number or people who are openly gay/bi, especially in the younger generations, i guess. There are alot more people that i know that are gay/bi than i would have ever imagined. In the last few months i've found out that almost all of my friends are bi (well, my close friends anyway)... I think I only know two that are 'completly straight', or that claim to be anyway. I believe that society is evolving in many aspects, and soon it wont be seen as a negative thing to be gay/bi. heh, and i agree that many gay people see straight people negativly. I know a few people that say any furry that says they are straight is really a closet homo. anyways i'm just ranting here |
"Yes, it is odd to see complete strangers talking openly about this sort of thing, but it is getting more common, along with the number or people who are openly gay/bi, especially in the younger generations, i guess."
I disagree. I'm fairly young still (17) and VERY few people around my age are open about their sexuality. As for your friends saying they're bi, or whatever - I have no reason to doubt it - apart from the fact that in some circles, being bisexual is considered 'trendy'. Weird humans. It seems strange that nearly all the time no one wants to 'come out' (revealing the persons true sexuality), but every person in one particular group says they're bisexual. It's too much to be a coincidence. I hope this hasn't come across to negatively.
Post by: Job on February 02, 2003, 09:49:40 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 02, 2003, 11:06:59 pm
Being gay or bi is more accepted now in most areas.. (try admitting you are gay in TX ) but there is still areas where it is not.
I think that more people are now open to trying gay / bi relationships becouse of this, and finding out it either works for them or not.. but this is now becouse they tried it and made the choice, where as before they would have been forced into the 'right' way of thinking.
Chaz
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 03, 2003, 11:25:22 am
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 03, 2003, 12:09:52 pm
I agree Drakonian, sadly it will always be that way. Some groups will always regect change.
Also in the future furries will proably get the same acceptance.. almost fully accepted but not totaly.
Chaz
Post by: Fianna on February 03, 2003, 02:20:55 pm
Fianna
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 03, 2003, 02:24:26 pm
| Quote (Fianna @ Feb. 03 2003, 7:20 pm) |
| When anything is completely accepted, I'm going to start worrying...there is too much varyance (sp?) in perspectives. Fianna |
It won't happen, I am pretty sure of that. Since when have any vast group of beings (like billions of humans, for example) all agreed, every single one of them, on anything? See. Nothing is ever going to be fully accepted, and that is the world we live in. Anyway, a utopian society would not be as good as it may first sound.
Post by: Job on February 03, 2003, 09:22:58 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 03, 2003, 09:35:40 pm
I understand where you are coming from. I agree that no-one can really be completely tolerent of everything they don't agree with. But atleast most people don't get violent about it anymore..
I don't understand how christians can say that being gay is 'unatural'. Saying man wasn't meant to sleep with man, as alot of animals in the natural world do it.
But I don't want to start a fight over it. That is there oppion and they are free to hold that oppion.
If any Christian can explain this to me, please do via PM or email, I do want to understand.
But the main point is as long as you love the person/furson you are with, what sex or furry animal they are doesn't matter. does it ?
Chaz
Post by: Jadnar on February 04, 2003, 06:16:15 am
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on February 04, 2003, 10:15:31 am
Oh, man I want to be able to write this without swallowing my paw up to my knee. I have to say that I am wired up to be with females, although, now, I don't think I could ever date outside of furry. Most of the human females I've been with think I'm weird, and I think the same thing about them. ie: I broke up with a girl. because she said "The Lion King" was a New Age film. I have not yet dated a furry female and would love to go out with one. And no, I am now not scared to have gay friends. I must admit I was quite the redneck about it a while back, but when my sister was a dancer, I met some of her homosexual friends, and I discovered that they are not monsters. Recently, I befriended Chaz Heartwolf when he still lived in Hampton. I now count him and his male mate as two of my very best friends and packmates. I am also very protective of them. I truly worry about them living in Texas. When they move back to VA, will I hang out with them? Of course, I will. I never had brothers, so I adopted them as my brothers.
I think it's hard enough being a furry, straight, gay, or bi.
I'm rambling. I will go now.
Thanks for the great discussion.
-Patrick
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 04, 2003, 01:56:14 pm
| Quote (Job @ Feb. 04 2003, 2:22 am) |
| I think we could all learn a thing or two from... southpark, heh heh. Really the episode about tolerence was a good one in that it showed that you could still tolerate something you didn't except, and it can still piss you off, but of course all people will never be tolerent, and i don't know anyone who is completely tolerent of everything they don't agree with. It's hard to say what's right and wrong in this world sometimes. Though i don't see anything truely wrong with being bi/gay I'm sure some people do. Mostly it's probobly religion. I myself am christian (obviously not the most devot christian in the world) and i can see where the whole 'unatural' thing comes from. Maybe man wasn't meant to sleep with man, but i love my boyfriend and would do anything for him. anyways sorry for the rant. |
'Tolerance' is an interesting concept. Like I think you were saying in your post, someone might not support or follow something that another person does, but can still tollerate it. The topic of religion is a bit touchy. I'm not religious myself, but I do know that some Christians believe gay relationships are 'unnatural', like you said. I don't really know why - perhaps there were some evil people in the Bible that were gay, or something, I don't know. Personally, I don't care what any religion thinks about gay relationships. I am (nearly sure that I'm) gay, and I love my mate very much, and no-one will hearten me.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 04, 2003, 02:02:48 pm
| Quote (Chaz_wolf @ Feb. 04 2003, 2:35 am) |
| Saying man wasn't meant to sleep with man, as alot of animals in the natural world do it. [...] But the main point is as long as you love the person/furson you are with, what sex or furry animal they are doesn't matter. does it ? |
First point, well question: What animals have homosexual tendancies? I'm not really an expert on animals in general, but I thought that they were all pretty much straight - in order to breed, and keep their species alive.
Your second point: I agree. I have never thought to myself 'I will never love a female' or 'I will never love a male', because in doing that, I'd be nessecarily (sp) cutting half of my 'chances' for want of a better word. It just so happens that I've ended up loving another male, but that is no matter to me. If he was the same person inside, just female, I'd know I'd still love him/her. I hope that made sense.
Post by: Job on February 04, 2003, 03:19:36 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 04, 2003, 04:17:44 pm
| Quote |
| First point, well question: What animals have homosexual tendancies? I'm not really an expert on animals in general, but I thought that they were all pretty much straight - in order to breed, and keep their species alive. |
To answer this first. I have gotten alot of information on this point and can lists alot of refference and biology books if needed.
Most male animals will infact have sex with other males in there group when the females of the group are not in seasion.
Also pengines started the prostertution idea long ago.. a female pengine will have sex with any male that brings her a rock for her nest.
The natural world has alot to teach us still.
I personal do not belive in the bible.. as it was writen by alot of different people about events that happen along time before they were born.
I beleve that people should follow there own belefes and respect each other.
It doesnt mater what sex your partener is aslong as you love them.
I love my mate and will love him for all time.
I protect my mate.. and SonOfEarth my brother.
SonOfEarth is stright (as far as I know) but that doesn't make him any different to me.
I hope that clears things up
Chaz
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on February 05, 2003, 09:30:50 am
Me, I'm a neophyte on animal behaviour. I've never observed animals in the wild. Where I live, the wildest things are squirrels, Yellowfin Tuna, and the occasional stray dog. Much of what I know comes from more mainstream Rated-G animal books and the Discovery Channel. We may never know what pictures never get printed or what film footage ends up on the editing room floor, because it may be deemed controversial.
To my friend and bro, Chaz: Beliefs and faiths are highly personal. I don't get in anyone's face. That's disrepectful and shows poor people skills. (ie: Don't walk up to a stranger and tell them they are going to hell. That's a terrible icebreaker. I gave someone a piece of my mind for that tactic when they walked up to me in a mall with that greeting.) Also, yes I am straight, but it doesn't make me better than anyone else. Do I care that two very dear friends of mine are gay? NO! I too will protect my brothers, and if they ever need anything or just want to unload, I'm here.
I hope I was clear, because I tend to babble.
-Patrick
Post by: Jadnar on February 05, 2003, 03:03:00 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 05, 2003, 03:19:09 pm
Chaz
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 06, 2003, 11:45:37 am
I never knew that about penguins, either.
And I agree with
| Quote |
| I beleve that people should follow there own belefes and respect each other. It doesnt mater what sex your partener is aslong as you love them. I love my mate and will love him for all time. I protect my mate.. and SonOfEarth my brother. SonOfEarth is stright (as far as I know) but that doesn't make him any different to me. |
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 06, 2003, 02:30:54 pm
| Quote |
| @Chaz_wolf: Well, I never knew that male animals had sex with other males while it is not the mating season. I guess it sort of makes sense, apart from the fact that no animals have sex for pleasure, apart from dolphins and humans. I'm pretty sure that's true. Maybe someone could shed some light on this. |
All male animals have sex for pleasure, I rember a while back there was a push agenst this. But pleasure is the only reasion they sex.
If dogs, for example didn't have sex for pleasure, why do they hump your leg at times ?
The reasion you have never seen it on the discovery channal, (except on very rare occasions) is becouse it is to controversial still..
But I can send you a list of books that confirm this information.
I hope this helps.
Chaz
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 06, 2003, 02:37:11 pm
Oh, and we don't have the Discovery Channel here (unless you buy digital TV stuff), but I'd like to see it. So many people mention it - it sounds really interesting and educational.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 06, 2003, 02:49:58 pm
| Quote |
| But how come I have heard on several occasions that humans and dolphins are the only creatures that have sex for pleasure? There must be conflicting opinions on the subject by experts. |
A few years back when they realised this admitting that amimals were gay too would not have gone down well with the public, so they tried to hide it and not discouse it on TV.
The humans and dolphin and k9's got lumped together as being the only ones that have sex for pleasure becouse they are the only ones that can have sex with another, without there partners consent or assistance (rape).
I will list afew books later..
The discovery channal is very good, (I get it here) and they are just now starting to let this information out.. slowly..
They are still worried as to what effect this infomation will have on there ratings.
Chaz
Post by: Benjamin on February 06, 2003, 03:12:10 pm
It makes sense that a male would do it for pleasure, since that's about all that he really gets out of it... except for a slap in the face in some species, and possible death in some other species.
Many animals have some form of performing masturbation, too... so that's further evidence that it's an enjoyable thing for them.
Benjamin
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 06, 2003, 03:33:25 pm
Almost all domestic cats and dogs masturbate themselves. Why do you think a cat or dog spends so long licking themselves there.. although unless they prop themselves up in a corner they tend to fall over
I have seen it happen, I have had 8 dogs 4 wolves and 6+ cats.. as well as other asorted pets. Including delta sharks and rodents.
I used to live next to a wildlife reserch center and help out with the wolves, tigers, lions etc.
Chaz
Post by: Ariela on February 06, 2003, 05:29:30 pm
Anyway, my point is that this is why this has been such an issue, whether or not animals have sex for pleasure, because we can just write it all of as instinct, if it's only ever male/female pairings and only when the female is in heat, blah blah blah.... but as this is not the case... Well, essentially, people don't want to admit that. Whatever... I'm going to stop rambling now.
-shuts her trap-
Post by: Bear Paw on June 22, 2003, 07:21:20 pm
Post by: Benjamin on February 08, 2003, 10:44:43 am
Certain people still believe sex to be a 'dirty' thing and should not be done unless you're intending to procreate. I believe the Catholic church still holds onto that belief, and likely some others do as well. It's likely in their best interests to perpetuate the myth that animals can not enjoy sex... and that humans shouldn't enjoy it either. After all, throughout history, religious beliefs have often been tied in right with scientific theories and paradigms to some degree. Not everywhere, mind you, but there still is a perpetual "war" between learning what's really happening in the world around us and sticking with what is believed through religious influences and morals.
Benjamin
Post by: Jadnar on February 08, 2003, 10:59:03 am
Sort of on the subject of this, I might suggest a book called Voices of Heaven, or is Voices From heaven. Either way, its from Fredrick Pohle. Its where in the future where religons are big, and they conflict majorly. Farily intersting and educational.
Though back to what Ariela said, I have to agree. The insect for example I doubt 'enjoys' the situation. It acts more out of instinct then feeling. Considering they aren't the most sophisticated creatures when it comes to feeling. The higher life forms such as mammels, reptiles, marsupials.... ect, have a more advanced emotional base, as enjoyment would be included. Though Instinct would still play a hand. From Pshycology I had learned that Humans are born with only three emotions: Hunger, Thirst, and the need to Procreate. The rest are learned. I think that if you are born with something, its instictual. If your hungery the instinct to go and eat is experinced and usually followed. Same with Procreation.
Post by: Benjamin on February 08, 2003, 11:25:45 am
Benjamin
Post by: Jadnar on February 08, 2003, 11:30:25 am
I think the only reason that its enjoyable is the fact that its made to be. Sort of like an Addiction. The instinct is there, which makes you go and do the stuff. The enjoyment is sort of like a reward, or perhaps a instive to persue it.
Like Coffee. People get addicted to it (by the caffine in it.) Cept its not really required, except for the speicies as a whole.
Post by: Benjamin on February 08, 2003, 11:53:42 am
The pleasure of sex is an incentive, yes. If it felt bad, it'd be a disincentive for breeding, which would be bad for the species' survival, really. And if it felt like a chore, well... we'd all act like like a marriage gone flat and not bother to do it at all.
Benjamin
Post by: Benjamin on June 06, 2003, 05:54:22 pm
I find that people never grow up. Everyone has their own special way of holding onto their childishness.
Benjamin
Post by: Schizo_Wolf on February 10, 2003, 10:13:56 am
I personally don't like those labels, because I'm not centered on loving a certain gender, but rather their personality.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 10, 2003, 05:27:35 pm
| Quote (Benjamin @ Feb. 08 2003, 11:53 am) |
| The pleasure of sex is an incentive, yes. If it felt bad, it'd be a disincentive for breeding, which would be bad for the species' survival, really. And if it felt like a chore, well... we'd all act like like a marriage gone flat and not bother to do it at all. |
Yes Benjamin,
That was what I am trying to point out. And thus it is the same for all mamals. The pleasure of it is an incentive so they do it as often as they can.
Chaz
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 10, 2003, 05:29:27 pm
| Quote (Schizo_Wolf @ Feb. 10 2003, 10:13 am) |
| I'm technically homosexual, for my mate is a male. I personally don't like those labels, because I'm not centered on loving a certain gender, but rather their personality. If my mate wasn't a male, I'd still love him (or her in that case). |
*nods*
I agree Schizo_Wolf,
I am bisexual for that reasion. I love my mate for his personality not his sex. and I have loved others, females before I met him and before we became mates.
Chaz Wolf
Post by: Bear Paw on February 11, 2003, 08:32:12 pm
I will say it does not matter your gender species colour race religion as long as you feel for each other thats usualy enough to bridge the gap no matter what the rest of the world thinks. "homosexuality does happen in nature it goes against the natural law's of reproduction but those involved don't seem to give a hoot. Reeligion never touch the stuff bad kama brings out the worst in some people, was baptised a christian by my parents but never assighned myself too any religion. Hmmm think I have said all I came too say and coverd most point's. If any one says that you have no commen ground you have too say We are all spinning around on the same lump of rock thats a start. Or they can try and go against that hehehe. I agree the reason people see most furrys as gay is becuse the can sit down and say hey im whatever. Having too tell people your a furry is hard enough I think they pretty much accept anything after that knock out blow. whew rant mode off.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 12, 2003, 02:49:56 pm
Well said Bear Paw.
Good points well put.
Talk to you agian soon
Chaz
Post by: Jadnar on February 14, 2003, 08:18:25 am
Well said.
Post by: on February 15, 2003, 05:55:29 am
| Quote (Bear Paw @ Feb. 11 2003, 8:32 pm) |
| I will say it does not matter your gender species colour race religion as long as you feel for each other thats usualy enough to bridge the gap no matter what the rest of the world thinks. "homosexuality does happen in nature it goes against the natural law's of reproduction but those involved don't seem to give a hoot. Reeligion never touch the stuff bad kama brings out the worst in some people, |
I think That Comes down to the IS/OUGHT gap, which does essentially render morality meaningless, unless of course you can prove a source for deontological morality (and Since no one can prove god’s existence that don’t count)
Basically, You cannot say What SHOULD BE, From WHAT IS.
I can go around spooning Babies eyes out, and I can live a long and happy life while doing so.
There’s nothing in the natural world, Apart from arbitrary human constructs to say what is “wrong” and what is “right”.
So The Reason For Some people Saying Homosexuality is bad is because of Human Ideological & Materiel reasons.
The Main Reason I should think for organised Religion saying Ghey people are bad, is because organised religion wants lots of babies thus more followers.
More followers=more power.
Obviously Ghey people don’t make babies if they are allowed by choice to conduct relationships how they want.
So Social pressure is applied to make it not so, And this attitude is essentially an ideological hangover from days of yore.
Post by: Job on February 15, 2003, 01:57:32 pm
Post by: on February 15, 2003, 05:48:36 pm
| Quote (Job @ Feb. 15 2003, 1:57 pm) |
| Anyway i don't see how homosexual hurts anyone in anyway, so i should continue to indulge in that behavior. If i burn in hell for it, than so be it, but i love my mate, and that's all that counts |
Well, It does seem to be rather logical.
More Children born into your religion= more people who will grow up following your religion.
It’s different now, but for example in medieval times, you HAD to be a Christian or you were burnt at the stake or similar.Most religions go through a persecution phase, like that.
In fact it was the enlightenment which finally brought Europe out from under the thumb of organised religion IIIRC.
I believe that at one point the pope even claimed the right to crown the holy roman emperor.
As For the Bible, I’ve read it a little, and I know a bit about its history.
The Old Testament was IIRC a collection of Tribal Books, and the New Testament was mostly written by St. Paul or someone like that about 70 to 80 years IIRC after the figure known as Jesus died.
Christian Sanctions against homosexuality usually come from Leviticus, Leviticus also says that You shouldn’t wear clothes made from more than two different types of cloth and also that you shouldn’t eat pork that hasn’t been blessed by a preist.
So Bascially, If’ve you ever eaten a ham sandwich, that was unblessed that’s just as bad as being gay in gods eyes if you believe in that sort of thing.
But I consider the bible to simply be a historical document, If you believe in god, you believe in god, But the message put across by the bible is contradictory and confusing.
Also there is the issue of mistranslation etc and the Whole tribal issues surrounding the old testament as well.
Post by: Benjamin on February 16, 2003, 01:16:27 am
Back then, they built colossal cathedrals that were incredibly expensive, a feat of engineering, and the most prominent structure in their cities. They were built to strike awe in the masses' hearts, as a reflection of the awesomeness of The Lord. The towers reached as high into the heavens as they could dare to build them in that era, with those materials.
These days, we're awe-struck by fast cars, sexy women, handsome men, huge sports domes that dwarf the ancient cathedrals, monuments built for the sake of building a monument... stuff like that. Churches around here tend to be rather inexpensive and humble in comparison.
In the medieval era, you had little choice but to be religious, since there was little else to one's life that was the least bit entertaining. Also, as I said, the Church held a lot of political power. To control more and more people, they would naturally want to frown upon any sort of sexual activity that wouldn't potentially breed new members for the congregation.
Also, you can consider the economic situation in the pre-industrial era. It was a sign of wealth to have a lot of children, since children could help out on the farm when they're old enough and help run the family business. If you've got lots of kids, you can put them to work... and you'd have someone around to support you when you're too old and/or sick to do the work yourself. It was a matter of financial security. With that in mind, you could imagine that they'd consider that there'd be something seriously wrong with someone that didn't want to breed or had some "unnatural" attraction to the same sex. It was financially unthinkable and unfeasible for the common man or woman.
These days, that doesn't matter so much... of course.
Benjamin
Post by: Job on February 16, 2003, 12:24:35 am
Post by: on February 16, 2003, 08:40:02 am
| Quote (Chaz_wolf @ Feb. 16 2003, 6:56 am) |
| Now adays most of the instructions are out of date, as I feel is there way of living. |
There are also the matters of Cultural differences between the various churches, For example in feudal Europe The Germanic Peoples of north Europe were a very martial culture, whereas the Byzantines where not.
When The Crusades where launched The Northern Europeans Where very suspicious and distrustful of the Greek orthodoxy because the Greeks thought that to settle it without violence was better, There was also the Issue of Just war, the Greeks thought that The best a soldier could hope for was Absolution for the deaths he caused.
Whereas the Crusaders thought that Killing infidels and waging holy war would automatically get you into heaven.
However they aren’t “out of date” as such, Just from a time when the Means of production, (I.e. Technology) were less sophisticated.
If you look a the Anglican churches in Africa today, Because of the lower level of materiel development there, they are still in the “more people for more power” mindset, and They Hate homosexuality and contraception despite the disastrous interaction with AIDS this causes.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 16, 2003, 06:56:16 am
I think Eisenschwarz is referring mainly to the middle ages, the time the bible was written for.
Now adays most of the instructions are out of date, as I feel is there way of living.
We need to bring it more up to date and more understanding. The idea of large familes was very acepted then.. but that has lead to an overpopulation problem in most countries now.
If anything human socity needs to have less kids.. not more as most religons want.
I do like one thing from the bible though.. for all the cristans out there.. try to find and read The Gospal Of St Tomas if you can get it without getting into trouble..
The vatican tried to hide it, the removed it from the bible when they managed to traslate it.. Although it is the closet thing to christs real words.. It is supposed to be written at the time he was around.
If you want to know why.. ask me or watch the move Stigmata
All from me for now
Chaz
Post by: Jadnar on February 16, 2003, 08:43:55 am
Post by: on February 16, 2003, 09:14:20 am
| Quote (Jadnar @ Feb. 16 2003, 8:43 am) |
| I don't think that the idea of having many children was just for finacial requirments. Back then medcine was pretty crude, and as a result many people died from sicknesses that we can treat today. An average family back then may have had 12 kids, but 8 of them may have died. That was one of those average things. |
There was no real such thing as medicine as we would know it today, that was one of the Reasons why the Black Death was so terrifying.
People had no idea what caused illness or any real empirical knowledge about what made you better apart from antique Greek Ideas about the Balence of The 5 humours, so they could only really pray.
as you say, when you have a high infant mortality rate as you did then, the more babies you have, the more likely some where to survive,
Although in many places in medieval Europe at the time, The land was supporting as many people as it could, often more, thus in a way it was self defeating, since the more people there were, the worse famines and diseases got, so you ended up having to have even more children etc.
Post by: Bear Paw on February 16, 2003, 09:46:36 am
Even religion can be wrong about something we only learn when we look back on it. As we humans are animals we still follow some of our basic animal programming. We need to breed pass on our genes ect. In the middle adges the continuation of your family depended on your children they where the ones who would carry your name forward. Due too the high mortality rate your family stood a better chance of survival the more children you had. Pluse family planning back them consisted of shall we or shant we tonight ?. As for god I will hold jugment on that issue until I see's with my own eye's
. But you could ask what right god has too control us after all he did give us free will should he there for get angry when we don't do what he wan't are we all just a huge game of SIM_UNIVERSE creepy no. I'll wander off now religion's ok but it's not for me.
Post by: Job on February 16, 2003, 12:30:57 pm
Post by: Jadnar on February 16, 2003, 04:12:44 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on February 16, 2003, 08:18:58 pm
. The problem is people who can't except that there are others out there with views that are against there's. The concept of free speach is a mine field you can't start in too it without treading on someones toes. You could spend a life time trying too convince everyone your right too no avail jusst easyer too live your own life and let the world turn by itself. The only time too get angry is if your own rights are being stepped on.Hows that for a pretty speach. Doe it mean anything not really??.
Post by: Job on February 16, 2003, 10:04:13 pm
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on March 27, 2003, 10:17:20 am
I myself, have learned that I can be friends with anyone, gay, straight, or bi. It doesn't pay to be a redneck when you want to be friends with someone. Chaz is my first gay friend. Yet, as for me, I want to be mated to a female (I've always been exclusive with females. It's how I'm wired up), and being 35 in RL, I'm ready to settle down and have my own little pack.
It is good that we can talk about this topic in a civilised manner. Welcome Baby Tiger and all other newbies. Dia dhuit (Hello) Joel, another VA fur.
Post by: Cravin on February 19, 2003, 12:16:13 pm
"Everyone has to be somthing no one can be notheing find who you are hold it checish it defend it embrace it whats right for you dosen't have to right for anyone else its your life."
Lin Bricker
Post by: sniffswind on February 19, 2003, 01:08:39 pm
I've been sour on faith ever since I got bible-bashed by one of those damn recent conversions. My faith went that day...what little bit I had.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 19, 2003, 01:43:57 pm
Religion has been the main course of wars, and is proably going to be the course of the next war.
Arnt we supposed to be more understanding to each other ?
Can we just let others belefs stand and not try to argue or 'convernt' anyone else here.
I have my own belefs, that come from wolves and my time with them, but I will not force them on anyone else.
Just my oppions
Chaz
Post by: Job on February 19, 2003, 03:07:17 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on February 21, 2003, 07:19:24 pm
We could broadcast it world wide and peace would finaly be here ( at this point we can move in to the other thread on the topic of peace ). It is inevitable that not everyone in the world will see eye too eye. Hey not everyone on this board see's eye too eye. The problem is how people address those problems u we can take about them the worst we suffer is a hurt pride a bruised ego or upset that our views have been little dented.We are serious about what we say here but we know how far too go. But some take it too far turning it in too a reason for vengance and hatred. The human being is one of the most complex thing's alive wich is in itself a miracle whether you base it in religion science or just dumb luck you think we would realise what we where and realise we all have our rights. Anyway this post is getting far too long and waffle filled. The point
It matters not who or what you are live at peace with those you can tollerate those you cant and defend against those who wish you harm. The rest attends too itself. Hmmm I think im getting far too zen in my old age. And your right Job it is quite fascinating how this topic has grown.
"Can't we all just get along"
(edited because I can
)Post by: Jadnar on February 21, 2003, 07:53:04 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on February 21, 2003, 08:45:38 pm
.
Post by: Firebreath on June 06, 2003, 12:40:52 am
I had a female partner about 2.5 years ago, had sex with her, and well... yeah... that's about it, really...
And now, I have a boyfriend with whom I've been with for the past 2 years in october, and well, I have to admit, bed sports are WAY better with someone of the same sex so far!
I beleive that it's just a part of nature. A small number of individuals are just "like that", animals or humans. I haven't done lenghty researches, but from what I remember of my biology class when we talked about homosexuality, "it just is". It's not a illment, it's not a "mental disorder", it "just is", like heterosexuality.
And I think I should be lucky to live in Montreal, where the gay community i rather well accepted (well, as far as I'm concerned with my own experiences...)
Post by: Jadnar on June 21, 2003, 07:08:05 pm
Ugh.. yuck...
*recovers a bit from the over powering imagination he has*
Anyways, Ya, I haven't experinced anything like that, but I figure such comments are bound to fly, specially with the more ignorent of peeps. *shrugs* Though I don't really try to pursuade them, if they were to say that to me. I mean, considering if they think that way, they'll probubly continue to exist in the black and white. Usually first impressions stick, and once they are stuck its hard to take it off and put it back on right.
Post by: Cravin on February 27, 2003, 12:57:10 am
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on February 27, 2003, 02:58:55 pm
| Quote (Cravin @ Feb. 27 2003, 5:57 am) |
| I am a catholic but I understand that people should be able to fallow there heart and own idea of what God wants or even if he/she/it is there, and listening. |
The first half of that sentance is good - how no matter what you might believe in yourself, you have respect for others, and how they wish to live. Going onto God is personal to you, Cravin, though you still show respect for those that do not neccessarily believe in Him. Many other religious people are like this too, and I am happy for that. But there are those that do live differently, and tell people that what they're doing is a sin, and not right to do. I think these types have absolutely no respect at all. They would expect other people to respect their beliefs, although they themselves will not respect or even try to understand other peoples'. I hope I have made this clear to understand.
Post by: Bear Paw on February 27, 2003, 06:46:14 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on February 27, 2003, 11:02:35 pm
Very cool folks and very rare in this big wide world.
WhiteShepherd
Post by: Job on February 27, 2003, 11:40:46 pm
Post by: Benjamin on February 28, 2003, 09:48:25 am
| Quote (WhiteShepherd @ Feb. 27 2003, 11:02 pm) |
| Nods.. this doggie has to pipe in and say I've been really impressed with our community. We have fursons from all walks of life and opinions. We can talk just about anything and we still show respect to each other. Very cool folks and very rare in this big wide world. |
Well, most furs are rather well behaved. I'm pleased that these folks are sharing their opinions. A lot of furs I've met are afraid to have their opinions known, it would seem.
Benjamin
Post by: WhiteShepherd on February 28, 2003, 01:36:54 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on February 28, 2003, 01:44:42 pm
Chaz
Post by: Benjamin on February 28, 2003, 02:17:12 pm
| Quote (WhiteShepherd @ Feb. 28 2003, 1:36 pm) |
| Nods.. though some are not in as safe an enviroment. |
I'm referring to even being among fellow furs, actually... though I do see your point in your interpretation of it.
Some people are just flaky to the core.
Benjamin
Post by: Cravin on February 28, 2003, 10:05:13 pm
I always felt that it is better to make up our own minds and not let others try and do it for you.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on March 01, 2003, 05:53:51 am
| Quote (Cravin @ Mar. 01 2003, 3:05 am) |
| @DrakonianDancer Thank you. I always felt that it is better to make up our own minds and not let others try and do it for you. |
That is always the best way. Though, unfortunatly, living in human society makes me see how scared they all are of being different, or of change. That is the reason they all stay together, doing the same as each other. And then, when they see someone/something that is not considered normal in their eyes, they just do not even want to try to understand or accept. This does pain me, though I, and many others have had to learn how to live with it. Even now, I am considered weird in the opinions, not because of my Draconity (I've learned not to speak of that), but because of my open-mindedness. No-one can seem to understand how I can believe in things they don't. To me, being open-minded is nothing - I know that a lot of people (general term for anyone) are open-minded - so I think that does go to show how frustratingly narrow-minded human society is. It is saddening, yet I, and countless others have just had to learn to live in this world. But I digress. Making your own mind up about things, having your own opinions, unbiased from the views of others is a wonderful thing. Keep it.
Post by: Jadnar on March 01, 2003, 08:21:57 am
Post by: Job on March 01, 2003, 02:41:48 pm
| Quote |
| when they see someone/something that is not considered normal in their eyes, they just do not even want to try to understand or accept. |
Yes, be we are all like that a little. I don't know anyone who is fully eccepting or tolerent of everyone and everything and doesn't judge anyone at all.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on March 01, 2003, 03:02:10 pm
| Quote (Job @ Mar. 01 2003, 7:41 pm) | ||
Yes, be we are all like that a little. I don't know anyone who is fully eccepting or tolerent of everyone and everything and doesn't judge anyone at all. |
I wasn't saying that. I know that very few people are accepting of everything, but a lot more could be more understanding, without having to agree and believe in what someone else does, if you understand me. I respect the views and opinions of everyone - that doesn't mean I nessecarily (sp) agree with them, but it means that I accept that is what they believe, and I respect that. As for judging people, I do not do that at all - I'm too open-minded to form any strong opinions on people at all. Though, again, I know that many people do judge too easily.
Post by: on June 21, 2003, 06:44:50 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on March 02, 2003, 05:39:37 pm
For aguments sake say you asked 4 people if they where normal and the same. They reply yes
You ask them to look at a tree and ask what type of tree is it.
3 reply an oak 1 replys thats a beech
The other 3 say he's mad obviously not normal.
You ask the remaining 3 what color is it's foliedge.
2 reply green 1 replys it's kind of aqua color
again the other 2 dismiss the 3rd as mad and not like them.
you ask the last two ok do you like it.
1 replys no the other yes they both declaire each other wrong and go there seperate ways.
Right this VERY simplified way but everyone started off agreeing it was a tree everyone was ok, in the end none agreed. The point being is that we are the same yet we see the world through our own eyes, how could we ever hope too bring together something that is so alike yet so diffrent at the same time mondo paradox if you ask me.
One other thing a question could god create a question so complex that even he could not answer it and could we be god way of trying too understand it. Are we just the universe trying too understand itself.
AM I JUST GOING MAD HERE DO I MAKE SENSE !!!?????if so let me know
i have too go and rest my brain it hurts after all that thinking in circles.
* bear paw runs screaming to a nice quiet sanctuary*
(edited too add honey for the bears out there enjoy
)Post by: MadDawg276 on June 13, 2003, 04:13:46 am
| Quote (WhiteShepherd @ May 23 2003, 2:16 am) |
| There has been a push for acknowledgment that homosexuality in human civilization and nature is common place and a normal and functional/useful part of nature. |
Another Article about homosexuality in the animal kingdom I saw a while back on Flayrah
Article
There are also links to other articles from that to more articles on the subject matter.
MadDawg276
Post by: Kada-Ru on June 06, 2003, 06:53:11 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on June 07, 2003, 12:03:29 am
). The experience of sex is how well your mind and personality meshes with your partner. It can be just sex or it can be pure magic and the best feelings of life. Wether your more connected to males/females doesn't matter. It’s all how connected you are (IMO). WhiteShepherd
Post by: Jadnar on March 04, 2003, 06:10:50 pm
No, actually Your point makes sence. Everyone has their own perspectives, as a result the definition to 'normal' does not exist. In fact I don't think the word Normal should exist. Its a word that should never be used.
Post by: Benjamin on June 06, 2003, 06:11:32 pm
Vive la difference, eh?
Benjamin
Post by: Kada-Ru on June 06, 2003, 02:58:45 pm
| Quote |
| In the gay community, most will demand equal rights for homosexuals, but there are still some that are poor embassadors and will make snide, degrading remarks about heterosexuals. |
I have seen this too in the past.
Once, when I was an apartment manager for a small complex there was a gay guy that was renting an apartment and we got to be good friends, or so I thought.Once I moved on and got my own place I let him move in and rent a room from me. It only took 3 months before I finally had to ask him to move on. (shakes head) He had been making really demeaning remarks about females etc., and since I am female, I just couldn't take it any longer. I thought he was one that didn't behave like that. I was sure surprised when he started talking like that. Perhaps he didn't because I was manager and didn't want to make waves. I don't know. But it was still sad and his words still hurt.
I am definitely heterosexual but I don't put down any of the gays or lesbians down. I feel that as much as I have a right to be who I am so do they.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on March 05, 2003, 02:17:10 pm
| Quote (Jadnar @ Mar. 04 2003, 11:10 pm) |
| No, actually Your point makes sence. Everyone has their own perspectives, as a result the definition to 'normal' does not exist. In fact I don't think the word Normal should exist. Its a word that should never be used. |
But is overly used. Everyone does have their own perspectives, as you say, yet many are affraid to express them, due to the fear of not being considered 'normal'. Normal doesn't exsist - it only lives due to those that keep it burning as an important part of their lives. I'm sure you can understand what I'm saying. There is no 'normal', only poorly made social views.
Post by: Cravin on March 06, 2003, 01:08:34 am
"A recent survay of american homes finds that 60% of the famlies are dysfunctional. Normal is most often associated with the greater of the whole, so doesn't that make dysfunctional famlies normal?"
I spent too many years trying to be "normal" when I was in school. Aways trying to fit the mold. Now I have found that all that time was wasted, because I was always who I was supost to be I just didn't know that at the time.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on March 06, 2003, 01:03:57 pm
| Quote (Cravin @ Mar. 06 2003, 6:08 am) |
| I saw a poster at work that might fit this topic. "A recent survay of american homes finds that 60% of the famlies are dysfunctional. Normal is most often associated with the greater of the whole, so doesn't that make dysfunctional famlies normal?" I spent too many years trying to be "normal" when I was in school. Aways trying to fit the mold. Now I have found that all that time was wasted, because I was always who I was supost to be I just didn't know that at the time. |
That's an interesting quote on that poster. It just goes to show that really, there is no 'normal'. And as for you trying to fit into that idea of 'normal', at least you can see through it now. Most people throughout their whole lives try to live and constrain themselves to be in this 'normal' catagory. Try not to think of having wasted your time before; think of it as a long search for how you are, and be.
Post by: BabyTiger on March 06, 2003, 04:15:01 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on March 06, 2003, 07:16:33 pm
Hey it help's if you chant it realy sloooooowly oop's sorry got a little missdirected there.
Well said BabyTiger (clear n too the point) and pleased too meet you thought I better say hello and welcome too the board hope your liking it here. You already seem too be joining in the disscutions look forward too seeing more of them.
P.S. The bear hug offer is optional
( edited because I like the edit button)
Post by: BabyTiger on March 07, 2003, 07:28:07 pm
and huggs
don't mind them at all i am yer friendly neighbourhood tiger after all
Post by: Kada-Ru on June 06, 2003, 06:06:38 pm
I have seen other gays/lesbians/bi's since then and I too still find it interesting that one can be so against the other. I knew a couple that were lesbians in CA and though they 'tolerated' males, even living in their home, they would still down bash them at times. I just thought it was weird at the time.
| Quote |
| Some guys turn gay because they were burned by women one too many times in the past, which isn't a very worthy reason for being gay, in my opinion. |
I'm not laughing at what you are saying Ben, it is just that I was telling WS a little story about my college days a while back. I had been so hurt by the male populace that I never wanted to be 'with' one again! I actually started thinking that if I were a lesbian things would be much better. Well, in one of my classes I was friends with a lesbian. I asked a lot of questions and luckily she was nice enough to answer them. When I found out that lesbians/gays had just as much troubles in their relationships as heterosexuals I knew I was best as I was. Besides, I liked guys way to much and the female anatomy really didn't do a thing for me! And you are quite right, because of being burned by one gender shouldn't be a reason to turn the other cheek, so to speak!
Post by: Benjamin on March 14, 2003, 06:44:12 pm
Benjamin
Post by: nevwyn on March 14, 2003, 11:14:10 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on March 15, 2003, 01:18:11 am
Baby Tiger: Great, we love hearing from ya Baby Tiger. Welcome to our Furtopia family!
Post by: nevwyn on March 15, 2003, 08:49:04 pm
but like the song says: I'm not afraid of being alone, it lonely I can't stand.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on March 16, 2003, 05:18:17 am
Post by: nevwyn on March 16, 2003, 10:11:16 am
I generally spend 23.5 hours a day alone, I don't mind that I chose to work midnights. But sometimes I look back and see some very very long lonely months, its about then I get scared.
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on March 16, 2003, 10:36:13 am
| Quote (nevwyn @ Mar. 16 2003, 3:11 pm) |
| lol it would appear I messed up the lyrics, its I don't mind being alone, it lonely I can't stand. But the sentiment is the same. The song is by Charlie Major It's Lonely I Can't Stand I generally spend 23.5 hours a day alone, I don't mind that I chose to work midnights. But sometimes I look back and see some very very long lonely months, its about then I get scared. |
I think I know how you feel there. I don't mind being alone (though I'm not alone or as long as you are) but I do sometimes look back and become sad, and also scared; usually for the future. What is it that you're afraid of, if I may ask?
Post by: Bear Paw on March 16, 2003, 07:10:03 pm
Hmm this is starting too sound like some sort of dum butt self help tape. What Im trying to say is I still like too be alone some times I just wish for a little peace n quiet to find myself again as I could when I was alone. But If you need others we're here and Im sure you could find others around you if you needed cheering up. No pressure or anything I kind of like haveing the time too myself now ( it's hard too come by). Hehe from one extream to the other oh well.
topsy turve world after all.
Post by: Joel on March 22, 2003, 10:59:36 am
Whoohoo, I found it again! I lost the address ever since the poetry contest...
Post by: Benjamin on June 06, 2003, 01:03:45 am
Benjamin
Post by: Benjamin on March 25, 2003, 05:07:43 pm
| Quote (Joel @ Mar. 22 2003, 10:59 am) |
| Whoohoo, I found it again! I lost the address ever since the poetry contest... |
That'll do ya.
Benjamin
Post by: BabyTiger on March 25, 2003, 05:55:08 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on June 06, 2003, 12:04:13 am
There is quite a bit of peace in knowing WHO you are when you realize you were just dancing/believing to please the society that raised you.
Post by: WhiteShepherd on April 10, 2003, 07:26:42 pm
I could see a world where people died missing there chance to live. Shy as I was at the time I decided I would never wait for a chance fate would never give. I would go out and find love. It was very painful as there are so many FAKE hearts out there. I was always exposed for the world to see even when I was hurting. But the "safe road" to keep to myself travels to destination called die unknown and unloved.
It was a lot of pain and tears. But I'm a better person, I've helped others, and I have someone who loves me.
I don't mean to make anyone feel bad. But I will give my experience/opinion. IMO: Don't wait. Share the hidden treasures of your heart with everyone who will look and step into the spot light. Do it now even if you have to go out of your way. You may look like a fool but love and friendship are worth it. A furson hiding in a room (coder's dungeon ie me) is not seen. Better than a spent non-refundable life looking back by yourself and saying.. "I should of chanced being a fool than alone.". me know I am a great person and have many great things to share. What you have to share good or bad you can chose and will make with sweat, tears, and smiles.
WhiteShepherd
Post by: Jadnar on April 10, 2003, 07:47:26 pm
-Alfred Lord Tennyson- quot from the poem Ulysses
In other words, Live life, don't let a moment pass by. Live it to the fullest ^_^ I think you can find a version of it online, if not I can type it up.
I belive in what WhiteShepard is saying. Its a grand message, something to live by. That everyone should live by.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on April 16, 2003, 01:46:22 pm
I have loved people of both sexes and although in time I have been hurt when they move on. I have always known that one day something would click and I would find the right furson.
And I think I have found that person now.
The fact that he is guy like me doesnt bother eather of us
I can't wait for my life to sort out and to have a place to be with him.
Chaz
Post by: zackary_rainheart on April 16, 2003, 01:48:18 pm
I'm new around here and this is my first post.. But see..this one attracted my attion and I desided to post here..
On that scale I'm proply a very close 6.
I meen.. even growing up I only every really had 2 girlfriends and then I suppose really only because I didn't want to apper weird to what few friends I had... I was already weird to just about everyone else.
Anyways.. After my first.. experiment with a guy I was completly hooked. and for some reason RL.. I have guy hiting on me left and right now... Guess I really am a petty boy like my boyfriend says.
Anyways...
hey I didn't have time to look at all the posts.. am I this farthest on the scale here?
Oh and any other Cute Guys?
Post by: Benjamin on April 16, 2003, 02:36:03 pm
I didn't have very many female friends while growing up, either. I was mostly stuck with hanging around a bunch of fellow geeks that didn't attract women terribly well. Still, I find that I prefer women as 'partners'. I've tried the other team and it does little for me.
Anyways, see ya around!
Benjamin
Post by: DrakonianDanceR on April 16, 2003, 02:55:11 pm
Now, when I was at school, I had loads of female friends - way more than I had male friends. I never had a girlfriend, or a girl who I was in a relationship with. It never seemed like anything I was very bothered about. Since then, I pretty much realised I'm gay. So I'm not really sure if it means anything about your sexuality if you had more friends of one gender than another, but who knows? Some say homosexuality is passed down in genes, and all that sciencey stuff, by parents. I don't know how they worked that out.
Anyway, welcome to the Furtopia forums, zackary_rainheart.
Post by: Jadnar on April 16, 2003, 03:33:08 pm
Post by: Nyskall on April 16, 2003, 04:25:26 pm
Post by: Chaz_wolf on April 17, 2003, 12:24:35 pm
I always have i think.. I find that its the person inside thats more important to me than how they look / dress or what sex they are.
just my oppion
Chaz
Post by: Bear Paw on April 19, 2003, 11:23:04 pm
hope u like it here.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on April 21, 2003, 12:12:02 pm
ouchLOL
Just kidding..
Thanks for the hug. Cute bear.. hehehe
*after hugs goes on prowl for a Hunk...
till i get caught .. if i get caught.
Post by: kitty on April 27, 2003, 12:16:19 pm
*hug*
Post by: grasper on May 05, 2003, 04:53:59 am
p.s. i have never seen such a peaceful message board in my life great work everybody!
Post by: Benjamin on May 05, 2003, 06:34:16 am
| Quote (grasper @ May 05 2003, 4:53 am) |
| p.s. i have never seen such a peaceful message board in my life great work everybody! |
Furries are generally a well behaved lot.
I run a few bulletin boards myself, and I find that most of the big problems come from outsiders trying to spam on the boards on the odd occasion. Trolls and such, really. Those types are at least easy to get rid of, considering the security measures built into these boards.
Benjamin
Post by: Joel on May 05, 2003, 08:57:08 am
| Quote (Benjamin @ May 05 2003, 6:34 am) | ||
Furries are generally a well behaved lot. Benjamin |
Oh... yeah... of course we are! :Hides Water Balloon:
Post by: Ecco on May 05, 2003, 07:20:35 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on May 05, 2003, 10:12:02 pm
Post by: grasper on May 05, 2003, 10:59:41 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on May 13, 2003, 04:12:15 pm
It seems my Co-workers are very liberal. too..
Noone who knows that I'm Gay seems in the least bit upset by it.
Well maybe one or two are a bit upset by it but thay just stay away from me and pretend I don't exist when thay can.
Anyways..
Not to get religious on anyone.. but I did hear that this year over summer chuchs will vote on weighter or not to start blessing Homosexual marriages.
Last time thay meet the vote i'm told was 50/50
So this year its very posibal that that the fatial blow aginst bigitry will be struck.
Thearicly speeking.
Post by: Rikimaru on May 13, 2003, 04:13:51 pm
well im gay and i think its gr8 that evry1 is so open and nice here. and the lack of annoyin ppl here is really pleasin. im only 14 and im findin bein gay a little difficult coz the last person who went public about bein gay left coz loadsa ppl wer really horrible 2 him about it!!! and theres this guy i really really like and i want to tell him how i feel but i'm afraid that ill be beaten up and stuff if he tells any1!!
grrrr can any1 help me at all!!
Post by: zackary_rainheart on May 13, 2003, 04:24:49 pm
I know the feelings.
I can't be much help thoue..
At that age I was spending tons of time alone locked in my room..
Thue I tell everyone it was to avoid my annoying cousin whom my mom was turiting/babysiting back then truth was I did it because I didn't feel quite right in my own skin.
Back at that age I was still denieing to myself who I really was and trying to see myself in the "normal" view.
*sigh*
All I can say is that I'm impressed you have admitted to yourself at such a young age that you are who you are.
Your a lot braver then I was at your age.
Post by: Jadnar on May 13, 2003, 04:49:11 pm
Post by: grasper on May 13, 2003, 07:31:34 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on May 14, 2003, 12:53:55 pm
"im a strong believer in the christian faith and im completely against homosexuality, but i dont think any less of you because you're gay. you are still the same person that i've always known and i respect your decision"
Post by: Jadnar on May 14, 2003, 02:54:20 pm
Post by: Kada-Ru on May 14, 2003, 02:56:24 pm
| Quote |
| "im a strong believer in the christian faith and im completely against homosexuality, but i dont think any less of you because you're gay. you are still the same person that i've always known and i respect your decision" |
Your friend is smart and very caring of others. I think you have a good friend there.
I don't know about being gay especially a teen that is gay. I would be worried about going public with your sexuality though because of the reactions of most people out there and you only being 14, it may cause a lot of problems for you.
Others that have been in your shoes could possibly give you some advice in that department. Good luck!
Post by: Rikimaru on May 17, 2003, 02:09:00 pm
Post by: Jadnar on May 17, 2003, 02:30:47 pm
Also, what exactly are you refering to? In your question. I don't really want to try and answer something that is pretty broad, heh. Okay, ya so I'm lazy *chuckles*
Post by: Rikimaru on May 17, 2003, 02:42:09 pm
Post by: Jadnar on May 17, 2003, 06:04:23 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on May 17, 2003, 07:54:18 pm
the skool i go 2, that society blows like i sed earlier on, the last person who went public left coz ppl teased him really bad about it! i spose that puts me off a bit but i dont think i care bout that anymore. if i do go public im jus tryin 2 think how? shud i do it by askin this guy i like out or in another way? hmmm im confused
Post by: Jadnar on May 17, 2003, 08:54:15 pm
Post by: Kada-Ru on May 18, 2003, 01:25:34 am
I mentioned there might be a problem Rikimaru because it could affect your getting a job, problems with your school and friends and your family as Jadnar has mentioned. I think most adults keep quiet about their sexuality as some jobs will fire you if you are gay.
Most people will tell you it is up to you because it is. No one else can make these decisions for you. It has to be something YOU are comfortable with. Others can give you advice but the ultimate decision will have to be your own. People can learn from others mistakes. For others, it is best to just come right out, others it isn't.
Post by: Rikimaru on May 18, 2003, 12:10:12 pm
how cud u 'strategically' find out thats kinda confusing (probs coz im in a dumbass kinda mood 2day!
kada
dont worry about not replying i c that ppl do have social lives (unlike me coz i live nowhere near any o my frends) i do c that its up 2 me and i have thought about the problems and i feel it wud best 4 me 2 jus b out wit it. im still confused how tho. i aint exactly jus gonna walk in the room shouting IM GAY EVERYONE!!! am i?
i also dont c y ppl r wierd about gay ppl i mean firing them from their job jus coz their different is like racism and its F***ING DISGUSTING (excuse me 4 bein a little emotional about that i jus have strong views against discrimination)
Post by: Jadnar on May 18, 2003, 02:19:05 pm
Though really, It all depends on the person, its something to think about really. Not something you should up and do right on the spot.
Post by: Rikimaru on May 18, 2003, 02:54:48 pm
well its a shame u cant really do wat u wanna do, that blows big time. i feel sorry 4 u! well i still think u wud make an excellent teacher! as for me i'm in a band thats goin really well and i hope to make a career out of it, but if that screws up i want to be a concept artist, for either disney, a videogames company or an anime show (i dont wanna do any of the computer graphics crap tho i can only use a computer for the basic things) i dont think they wud care about it. and i wud really like 2 meet sum of u guys in person but i live on the other side of the atlantic ocean 2 u guys (maybe wen the band is rich were gonna move to america anyways so maybe it will b possible!!
)
Post by: Zero on May 18, 2003, 05:29:41 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on May 18, 2003, 09:11:57 pm
Rikimaru just out of intrest what type of music ( am always intrested in most type's) do you play. Sounds like you have decent goa; set for you're self.
Zero sounds like you have the right idea some of the strongest relationships you can have don't need to be sexual in nature nor do you have to be gay or bi to feel a strong connection with someone of the same sex.
Umm I think what I just wrote sounds confusing so Im gonna just stop there befor I start gibbering real nonsense.
( Ps just sat re-read this entire thread no mean feat, I think this ought to be turned in to a paper on the subject all the points and views are clear put and some of the best writing and disscution I have EVER seen wow this is truly a gifted site
*Transaltion you should all give yourselves a pat on the back* )( edited to infalte an ego or two
)Post by: Rikimaru on May 19, 2003, 11:22:39 am
p.s. paw, where do u live in the UK
Post by: Bear Paw on May 21, 2003, 06:22:26 pm
Post by: Joel on May 22, 2003, 09:23:18 am
The CIA and FBI? Because we are 'More susceptible to blackmail'... nevermind about that fact that if a gay person told that they were gay to their bosses, they most likely wouldn't be effectively blackmailed through it...
Post by: Rikimaru on May 22, 2003, 11:16:06 am
and paw,
i live in cornwall and im glad u like punk thats kool. hopefully the band will get sumwhere so maybe we'll b touring sumwhere near u in the next few years! we'll jus have 2 c how everythin is gonna work out.
Post by: Benjamin on May 22, 2003, 06:39:27 pm
| Quote (Rikimaru @ May 22 2003, 11:16 am) |
| for a start i dont c how gays can b bad 4 morale and if they wer in the CIA or all of that secret crap how wud we b more susceptable to blackmail? |
That may all change when and if Americans ever stop voting "good ol' boys" into office... if you know what I mean.
Benjamin
Post by: WhiteShepherd on May 23, 2003, 03:16:29 am
http://www.subversions.com/french/pages/science/animals.html
Post by: Jadnar on May 23, 2003, 03:39:31 pm
Since the furry community is acually based on animals, perhaps thats why there is a higher Gay/bisexual to straight ratio. I mean if Animals do engage in this more then humans, then perhaps, just for arguments sake, that in a subconscience way, we are acually being more like our animal breatheran. Considering that It would seem very logical that we would only follow the course of nature. If nature does it in its multitude of forms, then it would only seem logical that humans do it as well, Not to mention that we as furries would also have those tendencies, haveing a closer link to the animals then humans would.
It would seem like a logical conclusion... *shrugs*
Post by: Schizo_Wolf on May 25, 2003, 12:27:55 pm
Most heterosexual relationships are only for breeding purposes, but there will usually be strong ties between members of the same gender that can often last a lifetime.
Post by: Rikimaru on May 26, 2003, 10:49:59 am
Post by: Jadnar on May 26, 2003, 10:53:37 am
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 09, 2003, 04:30:21 pm
I'm 100% gay and my best friend is 100% strait..
We sometimes tease one another about the facts but we both know its all in fun and Always respect the others boundrays..
Also I have pleanty of female friends.. I just make it ABSOLUTLY clear that friendship is as far as its going... but still thay hit on me.
I certently hope thay are teaseing.. I know some are but I'm not so sure about a few of the others.
Post by: WhiteShepherd on June 13, 2003, 03:54:48 pm
Though Zack has another good point. I think it is also needs to be said it’s VERY important to respect others for WHO they are. Wether someone is gay or straight “respect their boundaries” because you are respecting them. As all individuals deserving respect a NO should be accepted as easily as a YES.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 13, 2003, 04:01:14 pm
Post by: MadDawg276 on June 13, 2003, 04:39:04 pm
Any lucky ladies out there?
*crickets chirpping*
MadDawg276
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 13, 2003, 04:57:16 pm
.. Hey thay are fun to pounce in play... don't look at me like that...
*LOL*
Post by: Skunkwolf on June 14, 2003, 03:27:59 pm
Post by: Jadnar on June 14, 2003, 05:28:25 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on June 15, 2003, 01:36:39 pm
Mom was cool with it and said "As long as I was happy.". Though my brother behind my back told friends and family "the dirt" in secrect like I was a freak show. He never liked sharing much and friends and family became another. What hurt a lot is I had so much trust for him not to hurt me to tell him.
So I understand Jadnar sometimes you wish you could take steps back. But being forced forward they do have more time now to get adjusted to knowing/understanding the "real you" which I think will happen for the most part over time. Plus over time you'll learn even more of yourself. *hugs*
WhiteShepherd
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 15, 2003, 05:11:43 pm
At my first job out of college, I had a boss that was an ex army sargent, as redneck as you could be, and also gay. He never hid that he was gay and assumed everyone new. Well he was interviewed on the local news because he participated in a local gay pride in DC as part of a group of gay military servicemen. The next day he came to work, this born again christian women turned around and walked away the minute she saw him and started avoiding him like the plague. He thought it was funny, because he thought everyone new, and the women was one of the bitchiest people in the office, so he viewed her not talking to him as one of the best things that ever happenned at work. Sometimes a negative reaction can have it's benefits.
Drake
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 15, 2003, 07:10:28 pm
| Quote (WhiteShepherd @ June 13 2003, 3:54 pm) |
| Nods.. that is true homosexuality is a part of nature and life. I think the at least parts of this world are coming to a understanding. Though Zack has another good point. I think it is also needs to be said it’s VERY important to respect others for WHO they are. Wether someone is gay or straight “respect their boundaries” because you are respecting them. As all individuals deserving respect a NO should be accepted as easily as a YES. |
Very true. I'm a little behind in this discussion, and maybe as a 100% straight male, I'm not sure that I have a place here, but being that I now have gay friends and have gotten beyond the "gays are slime-trailing monsters" mindset I had drummed into my skull at a very conservative Christian grad school, maybe I can offer something.
Boundaries are very important and must be maintained. I don't cross the line with a female I have a very deep friendship with, because she is mated. I'll hit on her, but in a joking way (although I do find her attractive). One should never make a play on anyone if they are mated or if they are unable to change their sexual makeup. I know that for a fact, that I can only love females romatically and erotically, and I would be upset if a male friend wanted to go beyond friendship with me. I know that I could never be friends with that person if they carried their advances beyond innocent teasing or joking.
Post by: Benjamin on June 18, 2003, 01:20:09 am
Anyways... I'd have to agree that people have to respect others' sexual preferences. It seems to be a bit too common that people will be insensitive to others needs or lack thereof.
Benjamin
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 19, 2003, 07:45:16 am
I still have that teenage anxiety of being accepted as I am, I guess, and I'm glad that such matters are being addressed here.
Post by: Bormac on June 19, 2003, 12:09:22 pm
i doubt ill ever try again...better to have her think im not and be happy than for her to know and be unhappy? i dunno..
Post by: Manethran on June 19, 2003, 12:17:41 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 19, 2003, 01:43:59 pm
| Quote (Murph @ June 19 2003, 12:17 pm) |
| I'm bi. No one I tell seems to believe me. I've told friends, family, and others and they all think its a joke. |
I can see it know. "That's nice dear, just as long as you end up with a nice girlfriend."
Being Bi has become trendy, especially in the younger crowd. And some people say they are bi, just because of that. It's probably why your friends react the way they do. I'm not implying that this is the case with you, just that it is the case for enough people that someone who is truly bi may get this reaction.
My parents would have freaked if I had told them I was bi, and probably arranged a long session with the church minister for me to dispel those evil thoughts
Drake
Post by: Decession on June 19, 2003, 02:02:40 pm
Post by: Benjamin on June 19, 2003, 06:25:16 pm
| Quote (sonofearth @ June 19 2003, 7:45 am) |
| I still have that teenage anxiety of being accepted as I am, I guess, and I'm glad that such matters are being addressed here. |
I think that most people won't outgrow that aspect of one's life, really. Being accepted is generally rather important to social creatures like humans tend to be. It's part of our nature. As you mature and learn more about yourself, you will tend to be less anxious about things, since if you know yourself, you'll know in what ways you would be accepted and by what sorts of people. You get an idea of what to expect from others, basically.
Benjamin
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 20, 2003, 04:51:35 pm
For some reason one of the ladys I work with is gonna tell one of the navy guys she knows about me. But Everyone at work is pertty much "I don't care about your lifestyle.. so long as your not hitting on me" Or in the case of the ladys change "Hitting on me" to "hitting on my man"
Which I gladly Oblige... sence I'm not really intrested in anyone at or or who is mated already.
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 20, 2003, 05:01:59 pm
| Quote (Benjamin @ June 19 2003, 6:25 pm) | ||
I think that most people won't outgrow that aspect of one's life, really. Being accepted is generally rather important to social creatures like humans tend to be. It's part of our nature. As you mature and learn more about yourself, you will tend to be less anxious about things, since if you know yourself, you'll know in what ways you would be accepted and by what sorts of people. You get an idea of what to expect from others, basically. Benjamin |
I'm still learning where I fit in this furry thing, I guess. I may be 35 as a human, but my 15-year-old wolf self is very strong and that makes the desire to be social even more intense. I just don't want to be known as "oh, some of my best friends are gay and bi". Me, I don't care what you do in privacy. I look beyond that. Sexuality is only a small part of a very complicated creature, known as human. I know most of you are familiar with Associated Student Bodies. Yes, I have read some issues. It really isn't tops on my reading list, but I really identify with Steve the Collie, who happens to be quite straight feeling very out of place in a dorm with so many openly gay friends. Still, he manages to be friends with them despite differences. I hope I can be like Steve (without the experimentation he tries out in Issue #8 with the raccoon).
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 20, 2003, 05:05:50 pm
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 20, 2003, 05:07:11 pm
| Quote (zackary_rainheart @ June 20 2003, 4:51 pm) |
| Well.. its offical for me.. I'[m outta that Closet.. as just about everyone at work knows I'm gay and only don't wear a pride flag cause I never can seem to find one. For some reason one of the ladys I work with is gonna tell one of the navy guys she knows about me. But Everyone at work is pertty much "I don't care about your lifestyle.. so long as your not hitting on me" Or in the case of the ladys change "Hitting on me" to "hitting on my man" Which I gladly Oblige... sence I'm not really intrested in anyone at or or who is mated already. |
Zack,
Be careful. Virginia is not as progressive as it is made out to be.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 20, 2003, 05:12:58 pm
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 20, 2003, 05:25:02 pm
Post by: Benjamin on June 20, 2003, 06:39:18 pm
Benjamin
Post by: Manethran on June 21, 2003, 02:52:13 am
| Quote (Drake Blackpaw @ June 19 2003, 12:43 pm) | ||
I can see it know. "That's nice dear, just as long as you end up with a nice girlfriend." Being Bi has become trendy, especially in the younger crowd. And some people say they are bi, just because of that. It's probably why your friends react the way they do. I'm not implying that this is the case with you, just that it is the case for enough people that someone who is truly bi may get this reaction. My parents would have freaked if I had told them I was bi, and probably arranged a long session with the church minister for me to dispel those evil thoughts Drake |
I have noticed this trend to. I am part of the younger crowd (I'm 18), but I realized I was bi through an experience with a GF that I think would be inappropriate to describe on an open board. After which I have enjoyed guys and gals, but have not found the one I want to be with (I have time for that later though). I'll tell you everyone's ractions:
Friends: "Dude playing around like you were gay or bi may be funny at school, but if you act like it to much outside in the real world people may think you really are." There answer has not changed in 3-4 years.
Parents: "Sure you are baby. Your just trying to get attention." My mother works in a nursing home and often works with seniors that think they are children. I've heard her and other staff members say this to a few of them. My father just agreed with her, but he may truly suspect it.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 24, 2003, 03:36:03 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on June 26, 2003, 03:43:37 pm
| Quote (Benjamin @ June 06 2003, 5:54 pm) |
| Some guys turn gay because they were burned by women one too many times in the past, which isn't a very worthy reason for being gay, in my opinion. |
hey again
im back finally i couldnt get on the net (internet troubles). well in response to the quote is that this was one of the reasons i became gay, but it only played a small part in my decision. though i have neva been with a guy to properly find out yet, i aint been with a girl either so i dont really no (even tho the female anatomy dont do nuthin 4 me).
well while i was gone sum stuff has happened. most people no im gay now, i jus get random people comin up 2 me and ask me so i jus say yes really. most of my mates r like 'yea thats cool, ill still b ur friend'. other ppl dont seem to care. ive only had 1 person bein an asshole bout it and all my mates stuck up 4 me so he jus left me alone. i think im one of the lucky ones cos the last guy who came out left coz ppl took the piss outta him really really badly. ummm i found out that one of the guys i like aint gay so im kinda in a bad mood at the mo i only found out on monday
. ive neva felt like this about any1 before tho and its just gettin 2 my head. i guess i have to move on which is gonna b hard. there'll b others right? i wish ihada b/f so much. i've always been unlucky in love. ive been turned down by every1 ive asked out and i aint got a chance with the other guys i like.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 26, 2003, 03:55:51 pm
Thats why I now most cruse the net for a BF.. Some people (And furs) are much more open about themselves online.. but still gotta be wary of the ones who aren't who thay seem.. its a big risk really but the range of serching is a LOT bigger. Personal discression i suppose.
Post by: Rikimaru on June 27, 2003, 03:09:44 pm
a) I live in England
b) Everyone who goes in chat rooms from England are older than me
c) Any guys my age live in america and I aint one for long distance relatonships
so u c I'm in quite a predicament
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 27, 2003, 03:49:43 pm
| Quote |
| HUmm.. a throny stituation..Yes.. very thorny. - Tom Nook of Animal Crossing |
I think that statement sums up all I could say there..
Post by: Rikimaru on June 27, 2003, 05:43:59 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 30, 2003, 04:09:07 pm
Just keep your hopes up and don't let the fact that noone is there right now get you down... who knows every detail of what will happen tommarow... Just keep liveing and hopeing and working to make your dreams come true.. if you never give up eventually thay will.
Post by: Rikimaru on June 30, 2003, 05:08:50 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on June 30, 2003, 05:32:14 pm
I'm just happy that I was able to make ya feel better..
Post by: Rikimaru on June 30, 2003, 06:02:20 pm
just to ask a random question, for anyone who understands what dreams mean... what duz a dream in which you are falling and then wake up jus before u hit the floor mean. ive had a few of these recently and im scared about wats gonna happen.
Post by: Jadnar on June 30, 2003, 06:56:49 pm
To what it may be to one person, it is something diffrent to another. Something that you may have to search in yourself.
Post by: Wtcher on June 30, 2003, 08:13:31 pm
I think I remember someone telling me that those meant that one needed to make big changes in one's life or something. I don't remember!
Post by: Benjamin on July 01, 2003, 02:56:48 am
Benjamin
Post by: Kez Bentley on July 01, 2003, 03:39:16 am
ahh, lucid dreaming is fun, isnt it?
and ya, those falling into your bed sensations are a little unnerving. whats an even better feeling is when you are falling up, and when you wake up it feels like you are gonna go flying into the celing. now THAT is an interesting sitcheyation.
Post by: Manethran on July 01, 2003, 08:01:10 am
I was in school. Sitting peacefully in class. Another student came in and asked me to come outside, so I did. He stutteringly told me that someone had set my car on fire. I ran to the parking lot and sure enough the inside of my car was gone in ashes and was smoking slightly.
Post by: Rikimaru on July 01, 2003, 12:14:07 pm
| Quote (Kez Bentley @ July 01 2003, 3:39 am) |
| ahh, lucid dreaming is fun, isnt it? |
whats lucid dreaming?
i also had reoccuring dreams about being ripped apart by a creature that was kind of like a dog, but it had blood red eyes and had the body of a black cat of some sort. i woke up like screaming my butt off! i wouldnt sleep for the rest of the night after that. i dont have those anymore thank goodness.
on the subject of wierd dreams someone beat this for a wierd dream. that i had when i was about 10.
i was in my room, and on my desk sat this bottle full of sky blue liquid. it was thick so i couldnt see through it. of course being the curious guy i am i drank it. but what was freaky was that one of my friends appeared and sed that i was going blind and sure enough that happened. as i got my sight back i looked at myself in the mirror and i was a dragon!! i was quite scared by that the next morning. well they say curiosity killed the cat or in my case turns you into a dragon.
Post by: grasper on July 01, 2003, 12:45:31 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on July 01, 2003, 02:47:46 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on July 02, 2003, 06:55:59 pm
.
Post by: Benjamin on July 29, 2003, 11:24:35 pm
I think this topic is amusing enough to bump every once in a while, for the sake of the newbies here... and some of us oldbies, too.
Anyfurry got something new to add?
Benjamin
Post by: Byakko Wolf on July 30, 2003, 03:00:21 pm
Up here in minnesota, least in our schools in the city, it's not soo bad for gay or bi.
Post by: JonaWolf on July 31, 2003, 08:22:55 pm
Post by: Yip on August 01, 2003, 01:50:24 pm
I would't call myself shy, but maybe that's a denial thing. I'd prefer to say that I have a strong tendency to avoid contact with people I don't know. Hmm.... Okay fine so maybe I am shy. Anyway, I took a peek at this poll's results before I joined. If it had said that the majority was gay I don't think I could of joined. And that would've been sad 'cause this place is great!
Benjamin mentioned heterophobics, which makes me think of how "Equal rights" groups often go too far. Sure someone could loose their job for being gay, but now some of the laws they got make things unfair in the other direction.
For example, a black lesbian female (yes I know lesbian female is redundant) may very well get a job that a straight white male is more qualified for just because it helps fill the companies requirements.
It would really be nice if employers would just judge their employees based on their ability to do the job, but unfortunately that's not how it is. I'm sure some employers do, I'm just saying that it is sad we have to have such laws. And it's not "Equal".
Post by: Ingonyama on August 01, 2003, 02:46:58 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on August 01, 2003, 03:29:50 pm
i getcha im the same. as far as im concerned its one of the best things thats happened 2 me. i luv it!
Post by: zackary_rainheart on August 01, 2003, 03:53:37 pm
| Quote (Ingonyama @ Aug. 01 2003, 2:46 pm) |
| I'm gay! And it's not just furry gay either; I know people can be like that, straight in RL but gay or bi in furrydom. I like men, I like male furs, I'm a Kinsey 6. ^_^ |
I understood everything but the Kinsey 6 part.
And As mentioned before in Numorus places am the same way.
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on August 01, 2003, 04:37:32 pm
I'd say I'm a 2.5.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on August 01, 2003, 04:53:03 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on August 01, 2003, 05:01:55 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on August 01, 2003, 05:03:00 pm
| Quote (Vararam @ Aug. 01 2003, 1:50 pm) |
| For example, a black lesbian female (yes I know lesbian female is redundant) may very well get a job that a straight white male is more qualified for just because it helps fill the companies requirements. |
I think that happens far less than people think. The government does give preference to minorities and women for certain positions, but then they also give a much heavier preference to veterans.
Preferences given to blacks, women (not technically a minority) and other minorities is done to address injustices done in the past and also counter act existing biases against them. Many people argue that these aren't needed anymore, but they where when they were put in place.
I haven't heard anyone ask or any proposed law that would give homosexuals hiring preference over a heterosexual. The only thing people want to make illegal is firing someone or not hiring them for the sole reason that they are homosexual.
Drake
Post by: zackary_rainheart on August 01, 2003, 05:06:43 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on August 01, 2003, 05:14:30 pm
Post by: Jadnar on August 01, 2003, 06:25:48 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on August 01, 2003, 06:54:34 pm
Post by: Jadnar on August 01, 2003, 07:25:35 pm
Post by: Benjamin on August 01, 2003, 07:26:53 pm
Benjamin
Post by: Rikimaru on August 01, 2003, 07:28:15 pm
Post by: Jadnar on August 01, 2003, 07:33:30 pm
Post by: Yip on August 03, 2003, 02:08:43 am
| Quote (Drake Blackpaw @ Aug. 01 2003, 5:03 pm) |
| I think that happens far less than people think. The government does give preference to minorities and women for certain positions, but then they also give a much heavier preference to veterans. |
Maybe. But, I was just using that as an example. Perhaps I played on it too much and made it sound like it was the main point I was making. But what I really meant to point out is that care must be taken to make sure everyone's rights are truly equal; which is an understandably difficult task.
| Quote (zackary_rainheart @ Aug. 01 2003, 5:06 pm) |
| ...and I'm glad thay can't legaly use that as a reason to fire someone anymore. |
| Quote (Rikimaru @ Aug. 01 2003, 5:14 pm) |
| im glad they have laws against that sorta thing. |
Just to make sure there is not a misunderstanding. I wasn't saying I wish these laws didn't exist. I was saying I wish the need for these laws didn't exist. And I do see the need.
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on August 03, 2003, 08:39:26 am
| Quote (Vararam @ Aug. 03 2003, 2:08 am) |
| I was saying I wish the need for these laws didn't exist. And I do see the need. |
I agree with you 100% there. It's sad that these laws are needed.
I came in second for a job I really wanted at the time. The person who got it was a minority, and the manager who was doing the hiring told my supervisor the reason he chose her over me was that we were both equally qualified for the position, but she needed the job more than I did. Basically he felt that it wouldn't be that hard for me to find a good job somewhere else, while it would be a struggle for her.
I wasn't happy at the time, but it turned out to be a good thing. I ended up getting a much better job with both higher pay and much more career potential than that job less than a year later. Know I'm very glad that he made that decision. It would have been a bad career move for me if I had gotten that job.
Post by: Benjamin on August 03, 2003, 04:41:15 pm
Benjamin
Post by: Zarathus on August 06, 2003, 04:13:33 pm
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on August 06, 2003, 08:55:21 pm
| Quote (River Ceed @ Aug. 05 2003, 11:54 am) |
| Although I am in a stable, committed relationship with two male mates and I am female, I had to vote bi on the poll. Reason being that I do not fall in love with a person's body. What attracts me is the person's soul and attitude. The body is just a shell. All beauty fades with age, except the beauty within. And since I look for long term interests, the inner beauty matters much more to me then surface glamour.(Although, I consider it a bonus if the person is attractive also.) Insert tab b into slot a can be modified many ways. People find a way of showing affection regardless of appendange limits. Perhaps if more people looked at the soul instead of anatomy when trying to find a date, relationships would last longer. Blessings, River |
I do agree with River. I feel strongly for people for the what's on the inside, but when it comes to that one step towards romantic and sexual love, I can only relate to females. With me, it's pure biology, nothing to do with spirituality or morality. I'm incapable of feeling anything sexual towards a male. I can love a male, but it's more like a sibling relationship. Yet, when I look for a female, I am more apt to be attracted to her inner beauty, first before outside appearances (sounds lame, but I'm an idealist.
).
Post by: Kattywampus on August 13, 2003, 09:36:59 am
BTW, I'm a female who's strictly dickly--for whomever wanted to know.
Post by: on August 17, 2003, 10:01:14 am
Post by: Bear Paw on August 17, 2003, 07:44:06 pm
*runs off to gather his head*
Post by: zackary_rainheart on August 18, 2003, 03:56:00 pm
You DO mean it when ya say it. That makes you a great man.
Its never "lame" to be someone with Intrgaty.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on August 20, 2003, 01:39:26 pm
This folfy goes both ways and I agree with my bro, its the inner self that is most improant to me.. not the sex they are...
Your folfy
Chaz
Post by: on August 20, 2003, 01:56:53 pm
Post by: Jadnar on August 20, 2003, 03:19:32 pm
Tis explained along the last page of this thread. Read all of the related stuff... some misinformation along it. o_O
Post by: Benjamin on August 20, 2003, 05:49:38 pm
| Quote (Chaz_wolf @ Aug. 20 2003, 1:39 pm) |
| Howls, Well just in case anyone is wondering I am a very defenate 3 or 4 |
So which is it? The 3 or the 4? Or are you definitely indefinite?
Benjamin
Post by: grasper on August 20, 2003, 07:21:23 pm
Post by: Perimus on August 22, 2003, 05:59:50 am
Post by: Bear Paw on August 28, 2003, 11:10:36 pm
Ok have cast my vote and have recently found I may not be as hetro as I first thought bit of a shock to the system for me that one. I think I can add myself to the confution stakes going on here at the moment. Guess im gonna have to move myself up that scale a notch or two.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on August 29, 2003, 12:00:27 pm
don't look so glum.
If thats whats got ya down then I can honestly say that I for one won't think any diffrently of you. You still seem like a great guy.
Just wish I could get on more so I could get to know all the furs here as much as I would like.
Post by: Chaz_wolf on August 29, 2003, 12:25:18 pm
If you want to talk about it I am here.
And to end the questions I am a 4. Although I still tend to go both ways..
Thank you for pointing out the mistake in my wording Benjamin
Your folfy
Chaz
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on August 29, 2003, 04:00:27 pm
| Quote (Bear Paw @ Aug. 28 2003, 11:10 pm) |
| *comes in n slumps down on couch proceeds to stare at wall for a bit * Ok have cast my vote and have recently found I may not be as hetro as I first thought bit of a shock to the system for me that one. I think I can add myself to the confution stakes going on here at the moment. Guess im gonna have to move myself up that scale a notch or two. |
As Chaz and Zachary mentioned, were here if you need to talk.
I think a realization like this would be a shock since many furs and people partially define themselves by their sexuality.
Just remember, it doesn't matter to any of us here where you fall on the scale. We care about you just the same.
*Gives the bear a kittyskunk hug* sighs, "Probably not as good as one of your bear hugs but it's the best I can do.
Drake
Post by: Rikimaru on August 29, 2003, 04:05:28 pm
dont worry bout it, with some time and thought you will know for sure. And dont feel rushed to make that kinda decision, because only you can tell in your own time.
*BIIIIG hugs*
Rik
Post by: anguis on August 29, 2003, 04:17:37 pm
Post by: Bear Paw on August 29, 2003, 09:17:41 pm
)
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on August 29, 2003, 11:22:17 pm
Now if I could only solve my problem. *pulls out pencil and paper and starts writing*
"Young wolf male seeks young feline femme. Objective: lifemating and a few cubs"
Post by: Rikimaru on August 31, 2003, 05:15:45 pm
| Quote (Bear Paw @ Aug. 29 2003, 9:17 pm) |
| Have to do allot of thinking as the ramifications could be huge. |
sorry another dumb moment from me but wat duz ramifications mean. that word is too long. lol. *joins in the group bear hug hoping to feel good*
and gud luck with that ad Patrick hehe.
Post by: Bear Paw on August 31, 2003, 07:52:54 pm
Post by: Sunookitsune on August 31, 2003, 08:25:59 pm
Post by: Zero on September 01, 2003, 03:03:14 pm
Post by: Sunookitsune on September 01, 2003, 03:48:34 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on September 01, 2003, 07:04:33 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on September 02, 2003, 04:17:41 pm
Post by: Sunookitsune on September 02, 2003, 06:29:08 pm
| Quote (zackary_rainheart @ Sep. 02 2003, 4:17 pm) |
| yay I love being huged |
*hugs zak*
Post by: Rikimaru on September 02, 2003, 06:43:03 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on September 03, 2003, 04:25:15 pm
very funny guys.
*hugs them still *
Post by: Bear Paw on September 03, 2003, 07:08:46 pm
Hahah got the lot of ya.... oops erm did anyone else here a cracking sound. I think im gonna put ya all down now I don't think blues a good colour for a person to be never mind a furry (unless your blue anyway that is
)
Post by: Benjamin on September 10, 2003, 12:53:31 am
I know a guy who's rather homophobic, but he has more of a "flight" instinct than a "fight" instinct. Actually, a couple of our shared friends are gay, which he accepts. He just gets rather squicked out and nervous when it's talked about all that much.
I voted straight as well. I've tried the other team, so to speak. It's not for me. I can at least say that I gave it a shot and don't like it from experience. It doesn't do anything for me physically in RL, despite the fact that I would enjoy same-sex RP in furry-themed MUCKs online. I also don't particularly like the attitudes of some of the furs that are bi and/or gay, at least in the local fan group here. I think I've discussed that before in this thread... or that may have been on another board somewhere.
Anyways...
C'est la vie. Variety keeps things interesting. I agree with you that it's not the government's right to dictate what people can do in regards to their love lives. Still, try telling that to folks that believe themselves to be "morally correct". Problem is, it isn't particularly moral for them to be pressing their own ideas of what is moral onto their fellow citizens. Laws are generally based upon the concensus of morality in any given population, but things like that need to changed every so often in order to suit the times... and some things really shouldn't be written as law in the first place.
Benjamin
Post by: Benjamin on September 10, 2003, 01:00:22 am
| Quote (Perimus @ Sep. 10 2003, 12:47 am) |
| I have hope that when my generation is controlling our government, several years down the road, things will be much better. |
There're plenty of young, close-minded, oppressive folks out there, so I don't think that'd be so easy. Only time will tell though. You just have to hope that the laws of political nature reverse themselves and some sensible people get into office.
Benjamin
Post by: Perimus on September 10, 2003, 02:01:29 am
| Quote (Benjamin @ Sep. 10 2003, 12:00 am) |
| There're plenty of young, close-minded, oppressive folks out there, so I don't think that'd be so easy. Only time will tell though. You just have to hope that the laws of political nature reverse themselves and some sensible people get into office. |
You're treading on my future fantasy land!
** pounce **
Post by: Yip on September 10, 2003, 12:30:55 pm
Remember, even open-minded people can be wrong. In fact, close-minded people can be right. The real difference is when a close-minded person is wrong they will tend to stay wrong. (And they're a lot harder to deal with.)
Maybe I should try an example. Okay, lets say somebody doesn't like... um... polka-dotted ties. If this person avoided people who wore such ties, would that make this person ignorant? Okay, what if you replaced the ties with furs. (you know, dead critter furs, not fursons)
Of course, that doesn't mean it's right to beat people up for waring furs, or polka-dot ties, or whatever.
Here's another example,
The other day I overheard some people talking about the Ten Commandments monument. Apparently there was a monument of the Ten Commandments in a government building in... Alabama I think it was. A court judged that it should be moved, and a bunch of people gathered around to stop it from being moved. Anyway, these people I overheard were griping about that. Saying that the monument should not be there because the government is not suppose to support any particular religion. Then one of them says something to the effect of "If we wait 'til all the Christian Fundamentalist are there, we can get rid of them all at once." Okay, that totally blow me away. I mean, here they are basically saying people should have the right to whatever belief system they want, and then they want to kill a whole group of people based on those people's beliefs.
Okay, that last example may not have exactly fit. But, that kind of thing unsets me. (It's right up there with stereo-typing in my list of things that annoy me.)
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on September 10, 2003, 12:36:25 pm
| Quote |
| Thanks for your opinion, Iron Maiden. Sometimes, having to listen to all the anti-gay rights crap that is going on, it's easy to forget that there are straight people out there with a sane head on their shoulders, and who don't wish us gays would just disappear. |
There's a bunch of us sane straight people out there Perimus, you just need to know where to look.
Attitudes have changed recently. The supreme court overturning anti-sodomy laws. weiner Cheney, our wonderful (sarcasm) VP stating that what someone does in private shouldn't matter (his daughter is lesbian). I mean could you see a conservative republican saying that or even associating himself with a child that was gay 10 or even 5 years ago?
I don't see it getting perfect anytime soon and there does seem to be a little bit of a cultural backlash to homosexuality happening in the US. However the general curve over time seems to be towards more acceptance.
Drake
Post by: Rikimaru on September 10, 2003, 03:23:43 pm
there are sane straight ppl out there im friends with loads of them! its just they show all the bad stuff on T.V cuz it gets ratings. I had to listen to this anti-gay crap as well on the news.
Vararam gud point about the homophobe. You put it in a way i cud understand, which is sumthin i cant do cuz im dumb lol.
and hopefully england (and america) will have someone in the office who aint a bunch of warmongers. grrrrrr.....
Post by: Perimus on September 10, 2003, 04:13:30 pm
The news didn't mention it, but Roy Moore was the same Judge in Alabama that took a girl's kid away and gave it back to the physically abusive drunken husband because he felt lesbians aren't fit to raise children. Then he wrote a court brief about how homosexuality is immoral, and he felt that gays should be arrested under alabama law.
Once a court justice is elected in alabama, there's no way to get rid of them. :-/ They are there for life, unless they resign.
Post by: Yip on September 10, 2003, 10:24:15 pm
| Quote (Drake Blackpaw @ Sep. 10 2003, 12:36 pm) |
| Attitudes have changed recently. The supreme court overturning anti-sodomy laws. weiner Cheney, our wonderful (sarcasm) VP stating that what someone does in private shouldn't matter (his daughter is lesbian). I mean could you see a conservative republican saying that or even associating himself with a child that was gay 10 or even 5 years ago? |
Anti-sodomy laws? I didn't know we had such things. How long ago was this? You said recently? So these laws were on the books at the same time as the ones to stop businesses and such from discriminating based on sexual orientation? If so, that's just nuts. And how the heck were they suppose to enforce something like that anyway?
Post by: River Ceed on September 10, 2003, 11:39:50 pm
Yes the two different laws (anti discrimination and anti sodomy) laws WERE on the books at the same time. Stupid huh? I thought so too when I took a college class dealing with these types of issues. I learned there that the reason many states still have freaky laws which contradict newer 'fairer' ones, is because once something becomes a law, the process needed for it to be removed from the lawbooks is too complex and time comsuming for most politicians to want to bother with. Most of the 'weird' laws aren't really widely known anymore, so they (the collective group of ppl who COULD remove them) feel that what people don't know... won't hurt them. But that whole system backfires when a lawyer researches the books and finds a law which supports getting a guilty client off the hook, or which supports the lawyers theme in prosecuting an otherwise innocent victim of the system.
This is where those obscure laws are misused and enforced. (You asked how and if they were still enforced.)
Examples?:
In VA, a few years ago, a custody battle was going on between a father (straight man) and his ex wife (declared lesbian after the separation) concerning their young son. The mother was a good woman, no records of illegal activity, not even a speeding ticket. The father, while a good person in general, has some questionable dealings (affairs) and such, putting it into valid question as to whether he would be suitable for raising a child. Sounds simple enough.. the mother should get the kid..right? Nope..she didn't.
The father hired a good laywer, who knew of an anti-sodomy law on the book in VA. It stated (and still states today.. unless it falls under the newly overturned laws) that any sexual act beyond the missionary position between a man and a woman is considered immoral and lude. It is punishable by fines. During the course of the questioning, the father's laywer asked the mother if she had a lover. Yes. Did she express physical affection beyond hand holding and kisses with that lover? Yes. Did she have sexual relations with that lover? Yes, of course, they loved one another. BAM!
Father's laywer brought up the old law, the mothers innocent and honest testimony proved her to be in violation of the law. And since it stated that the act was immoral and lude... the mother was determined to be unfit for custody. Case closed... legally. Sucks doesn't it?
Another example, I do not remember when it happened, but it was in VA again and was a case I had to study and debate in that class I mentioned. Man beats the hell out of his wife. She calls cops and evidence is mounting in the woman's behalf. The man even admits to hitting her ...excessively at that. Clear case of him going to jail for assult, right? Nope.
Another obscure law on the books here is that a man cannot beat his wife with anything bigger then his thumb, ... other then on Thursday night then it is up to his discretion as to how he 'disciplines' her. Crazy? Unfair? Totally off the hinges? YEP. But... the man hired a 'good laywer' (snake in my eyes) who researched...found the law... and guess what night the occurance happened on? Yep, a Thursday. The judge had no choice but to declare the man not guilty due to the old law. Part of his ruling even included the phrase, "You son of a B****, if it had been any other evening, your butt would have been mine." Again... it sucks.
So yeah. the old laws which should be removed once they contradict a newer fairer law, SHOULD be removed and should NEVER be allowed to have an effect on the cases like the two I described. Will they be totally overturned and forgotten? No, probaly not... at least not as long as there are those lawyers and judges who can use them to bend the truth and bend things in favor for those who line their pockets with cash. Not in this world anyway.
~River
Post by: grasper on September 11, 2003, 01:21:31 am
| Quote |
| Anti-sodomy laws? I didn't know we had such things. How long ago was this? You said recently? So these laws were on the books at the same time as the ones to stop businesses and such from discriminating based on sexual orientation? If so, that's just nuts. And how the heck were they suppose to enforce something like that anyway? |
I just began my criminal justice class and everyone in the class recived a copy of the new york state penal code, i looked this up and suprise suprise:
consentual sodomy was illegal at the time the books were published, i checked online for the current laws and found this
from the new york state penal code:
| Quote |
| S 130.40 Sodomy in the third degree. A person is guilty of sodomy in the third degree when: 1. He or she engages in deviate sexual intercourse with a person who is incapable of consent by reason of some factor other than being less than seventeen years old; 2. Being twenty-one years old or more, he or she engages in deviate sexual intercourse with a person less than seventeen years old; or 3. He or she engages in deviate sexual intercourse with another person without such person`s consent where such lack of consent is by reason of some factor other than incapacity to consent. Sodomy in the third degree is a class E felony. S 130.45 Sodomy in the second degree. A person is guilty of sodomy in the second degree when: 1. being eighteen years old or more, he or she engages in deviate sexual intercourse with another person less than fifteen years old; or 2. he or she engages in deviate sexual intercourse with another person who is incapable of consent by reason of being mentally disabled or mentally incapacitated. It shall be an affirmative defense to the crime of sodomy in the second degree as defined in subdivision one of this section that the defendant was less than four years older than the victim at the time of the act. Sodomy in the second degree is a class D felony. S 130.50 Sodomy in the first degree. A person is guilty of sodomy in the first degree when he or she engages in deviate sexual intercourse with another person: 1. By forcible compulsion; or 2. Who is incapable of consent by reason of being physically helpless; or 3. Who is less than eleven years old; or 4. Who is less than thirteen years old and the actor is eighteen years old or more. Sodomy in the first degree is a class B felony. |
deviant sexual intercourse is defined as:
| Quote |
| 2. "Deviate sexual intercourse" means sexual conduct between persons not married to each other consisting of contact between the weiner and the anus, the mouth and weiner, or the mouth and the vulva. |
in my textbook this is different: sodomy in the 3rd degree includes consentual deviate sexual intercourse.
( i assume this is the law that was ruled unconstitutional by the suprime court)
it is a class e felony, which means a sentence of up to:
| Quote |
(e) For a class E felony, the term shall be fixed by the court, and shall not exceed four years. 3. Minimum period of imprisonment. The minimum period of imprisonment under an indeterminate sentence shall be at least one year |
basically, until the suprime court case, it was possible for soeone to recive up to 4 years in prision for consentual deviate sexual intercourse.
also this is aparently a new section:
| Quote |
| S 130.16 Sex offenses; corroboration. A person shall not be convicted of consensual sodomy, or an attempt to commit the same, or of any offense defined in this article of which lack of consent is an element but results solely from incapacity to consent because of the victim`s mental defect, or mental incapacity, or an attempt to commit the same, solely on the testimony of the victim, unsupported by other evidence tending to: (a) Establish that an attempt was made to engage the victim in sexual intercourse, deviate sexual intercourse, or sexual contact, as the case may be, at the time of the occurrence; and (b) Connect the defendant with the commission of the offense or attempted offense. |
it should be noted, that this is NEW YORK, not some sort of overly consirvative state, im sure the laws were alot stricter in some other places.
Just some factual information for you guys
Post by: Yip on September 11, 2003, 11:14:02 am
Okay, I read though the first quote and it seems to me like it's largely about "deviant sexual intercourse" with kids. I thought there was a different term of that kind of thing. Also, if it's not consentual wouldn't that be considered rape? I guess "sodomy" is a very broad term.
Anyway, that last quote looses me. I think I can kinda get what it says, but feel like I'm almost guessing about it. They should avoid sentences with more than 2 or 3 commas. Reading those things can be very exhausting. (It is for me anyway.)
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on September 11, 2003, 12:25:36 pm
| Quote (Vararam @ Sep. 11 2003, 11:14 am) |
| Anyway, that last quote looses me. I think I can kinda get what it says, but feel like I'm almost guessing about it. They should avoid sentences with more than 2 or 3 commas. Reading those things can be very exhausting. (It is for me anyway.) |
That's one of the reasons laywers make a lot of money, there the only ones that can read what the write.
The Supreme Court case was on the Texas Anti-Sodomy law. The neighbor with a grudge against the gay couple living next to him called the police and reported a domestic disturbance at there house. The police came, broke into the house and discovered the couple in the midst of a consensual act.
They were arrested and prosecuted under the Texas anti-sodomy law. The Supreme Court case over turned the conviction and basically stated that consensual sexual acts done in private between consenting adults was not under the control of the government.
I believe technically the laws still exist but the Supreme Court ruling makes them unenforcable as a state no longer has the right to arrest someone for a consensual private act.
These laws did not get much enforcement, but they were always available to use against someone who the government didn't like. With Texas, all it took was one person with a grudge to get someone arrested.
Post by: grasper on September 11, 2003, 03:22:29 pm
| Quote |
| Yeah. Legal text. Okay, I read though the first quote and it seems to me like it's largely about "deviant sexual intercourse" with kids. I thought there was a different term of that kind of thing. Also, if it's not consentual wouldn't that be considered rape? I guess "sodomy" is a very broad term. Anyway, that last quote looses me. I think I can kinda get what it says, but feel like I'm almost guessing about it. They should avoid sentences with more than 2 or 3 commas. Reading those things can be very exhausting. (It is for me anyway.) |
sorry buddy, im kinda used to it, (bolth my parents are lawyers, and i work in their offices alot) basically if you read the whole thing, the large quote was Post-suprime court, and dosent have the section on consentual sodomy, but the penal code textbook i have which was pre-suprime court case, says its illegal to participate in deviate sexual intercourse (oral/anal sex) even WITH consent.
Post by: Pillowmint on September 13, 2003, 10:42:27 pm
Glad to know that, contrary to some bilge I've read online, I'm not the only one.
Post by: zackary_rainheart on September 24, 2003, 06:01:28 pm
Oh well.
*blush*
Post by: naquadria on September 24, 2003, 06:41:43 pm
Post by: on December 07, 2004, 01:28:24 am
Post by: Benjamin on September 29, 2003, 04:55:58 pm
| Quote (Running Wild @ Sep. 28 2003, 11:55 pm) |
| One more thing... does anyone else feel that those who can be up front and comfortable with their homosexuality or possibility thereof are general much nicer, more outgoing folks? |
I don't know about being "up front" with one's sexuality really helps, since I've seen some gay furs be very up front about their gayness yet make it seem more like a front for a weak self esteem or lack of confidence. I find that people that are more comfortable with the sexuality, be it gay, bi, or straight, are less obnoxious about it... or so it seems from my point of view. Being less obnoxious doesn't necessarily mean being nicer though.
Personality and demeanor doesn't really conicide too well with one's confidence in their sexuality, in my experience. They're fairly independant factors, really.
Benjamin
Post by: Running Wild on September 28, 2003, 11:55:21 pm
Forgive me if somefur already made this notation already, but according to the poll results as of this moment it appears that the furry/gay stereotype is quite overblown.. half the furs here voted straight. That's more the percentage I'd expect...
Myself, I am bi... I guess. I've had sexual experiences with a female but never a male, but I've been romantically interested in certain males. I'm not certain I'd truly enjoy a sexual experience with one until I tried it. Perhaps a better term for me is "bi-curious." I don't see any reason to limit my range of choices to one particular gender, as society believes is "right." Human society is completely warped, and I won't even get into homosexuality and religion here. *Growl* I think I have a near perfect balance of masculine and feminine traits... perhaps that is one of the reasons why I feel I could be compatible with either sex on a romantic level.
I've seen some stunning female furs... but a lot of male furs have also made me swoon. So, basically, I switch my uniform back and forth and bat for both teams.
One more thing... does anyone else feel that those who can be up front and comfortable with their homosexuality or possibility thereof are general much nicer, more outgoing folks?
Post by: Kada-Ru on September 29, 2003, 12:19:41 am
I think the reason furs seem to be warmer towards others, and not all are, is because of the kinship they feel about their beliefs.
The way I am now is the same way I was BEFORE I found the fandom. I'm not sure that because someone found out they were a fur made them any nicer etc. I think for them to be nice they would have had to be a nice person to begin with. If that makes any sense.
Post by: Lobar on September 29, 2003, 11:01:20 pm
). So I dunno. *shrugs*I don't know about being furry making you nice, but this board has some of the nicest (semi)people I've ever met
. I think I heard a rumor somewhere that if Kada-Ru ever said something negative her wings would fall off... kidding
Post by: Kada-Ru on September 30, 2003, 12:54:25 am
Though, I have had my days! (looks on my back hoping no one sees the super-glue) Yup, My wings are still attached!
Where in the world did you hear THAT rumor?
Post by: zackary_rainheart on September 30, 2003, 05:56:25 pm
I don't think that coment on people being up-frount about thier prefrance being more outgoing is true.
I'm gay and upfrount and comphtable with it.. still I'm usually a complet wall-frower till I get comphtable with someone, face to face anyways.
I'm just shy i suppose.
Post by: firefox_b on October 01, 2003, 08:26:31 am
Post by: Perimus on October 01, 2003, 05:01:22 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on October 01, 2003, 06:03:01 pm
Post by: WhiteShepherd on October 01, 2003, 08:38:08 pm
***Incomming!!!!!!*** *Dives into the group hug!* ^-^
Post by: Bear Paw on October 01, 2003, 10:29:15 pm
** Gets swept up in the group hug**
Post by: Lobar on October 02, 2003, 01:33:28 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 02, 2003, 03:45:09 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 02, 2003, 06:07:49 pm
*runs in with arms wide open and jums onto the pile*
Post by: Sunookitsune on October 02, 2003, 08:22:10 pm
*dives into the group hug*
Post by: Kada-Ru on October 02, 2003, 10:53:33 pm
I think it was about 'furry sexuality'. What ever that means!
I don't remember any more. Too much fur flying about to know where one begins and the others end!hmms... sounds like a pic!
Post by: Perimus on October 03, 2003, 12:31:19 am
Hmm... this was bound to happen sooner or later when dealing with furry sexuality!
Post by: firefox_b on October 03, 2003, 08:14:49 am
Post by: Lobar on October 03, 2003, 11:22:15 am
*continues to be squeezed by multiple hugs (oof!
)*
Post by: firefox_b on October 03, 2003, 11:54:23 am
Post by: zackary_rainheart on October 03, 2003, 01:52:21 pm
Sorry.. I uh.. need to get some air.. clostophia.
Post by: Rikimaru on October 03, 2003, 05:14:32 pm
owww man my head hurts, but im still glad i joined in!
p.s zack, is claustrophobia (i think)
Post by: zackary_rainheart on October 07, 2003, 12:31:01 pm
Post by: Murrg on October 14, 2003, 03:58:39 pm
With that said *dives into group hug*
Post by: Varg the wanderer on October 16, 2003, 04:54:00 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 16, 2003, 05:17:05 pm
| Quote (Varg the wanderer @ Oct. 16 2003, 4:54 pm) |
| I dunno what I am. I have never realy had a sexual attraction tward either sex. I can't see myself having a girlfriend or getting married either. Mabey I'm just wierd. Nothing different there. |
Not everyone is wired to be sexually attracted to others. Some people/furs are asexual. If you feel fine with how you are, that's all that matters.
Post by: Rabis on October 19, 2003, 07:38:21 am
Post by: Benjamin on October 19, 2003, 02:52:07 pm
Benjamin
Post by: Kada-Ru on October 19, 2003, 04:02:59 pm
Post by: Benjamin on October 19, 2003, 06:16:54 pm
Benjamin
Post by: Rabis on October 19, 2003, 07:11:26 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 20, 2003, 02:55:41 pm
I've had the same experience with furs that I have met, but as the fandom expands I think the ratios will grow closer to that of the general population.
Post by: Benjamin on October 20, 2003, 07:19:12 pm
I find that a lot of the actively social furries around Toronto are gay, but there are a lot of straight furs around the area that seem to have lives outside of the fandom or do their own thing in regards to their involvement in furry.
Benjamin
Post by: on October 23, 2003, 12:34:48 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 23, 2003, 08:15:52 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 23, 2003, 08:25:02 pm
| Quote (chimera soul @ Oct. 23 2003, 8:15 pm) |
| now that would be worth watching but if i have anything to say aboout it you wont need to |
Splashes some water on Chimera and laughs. "Now, now... this is a pg-13 forum. There are other furry forums for that type of stuff."
Post by: on October 23, 2003, 08:36:09 pm
*nuzzles up to Drake*
You're loss.
Post by: chimera soul on October 23, 2003, 08:38:28 pm
*nuzzles up to kome*
Post by: on October 23, 2003, 08:44:59 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 23, 2003, 08:50:11 pm
There's plenty of places on the net for furs to play like that, but since your both under 18, I won't say anymore.
Post by: on October 23, 2003, 08:52:43 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 23, 2003, 09:01:59 pm
Post by: on October 23, 2003, 09:04:38 pm
Better be a good boy. I wouldn't want to have to tie you up.
Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on October 23, 2003, 11:48:10 pm
All this talk about feline femmes is making this straight canine male really worked up.
Post by: Lobar on October 23, 2003, 11:49:45 pm
Oh, my...If this keeps up we may all need to be punished...now look what you did, you're making me think dirty now!
Post by: on October 23, 2003, 11:56:44 pm
*tickles him with my tail*
I've only just got here.
Post by: Running_Wolf on October 24, 2003, 02:11:27 pm
.
Post by: beyond the darkness on October 24, 2003, 02:14:30 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 03:12:07 pm
Oh please.
Post by: chimera soul on October 24, 2003, 03:14:52 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 03:22:50 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 24, 2003, 03:24:04 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 03:49:48 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 24, 2003, 03:54:28 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 04:00:23 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 24, 2003, 04:11:35 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 04:15:26 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 24, 2003, 04:23:18 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 06:12:36 pm
Post by: Otto Lontra on October 24, 2003, 11:18:07 pm
Post by: Murrg on October 24, 2003, 11:22:27 pm
Post by: on October 24, 2003, 11:38:16 pm
Post by: Benjamin on October 24, 2003, 11:55:34 pm
| Quote (Otto @ Oct. 24 2003, 11:18 pm) |
| Kind of a minority within the furry fandom. |
Well, considering the poll results here so far, it's not a minority. Hmm... Things have been changing a lot over the past few years, of course. Homosexuality isn't as prominent as it once was. Still... Around Toronto, I find that most of the socially active furs that come out to furry gatherings are gay or bi. That's slowly changing though, and some of the events have different demographics from others.
Benjamin
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 12:01:01 am
Did that make any sense?
Post by: Murrg on October 25, 2003, 12:15:54 am
Post by: Benjamin on October 25, 2003, 12:27:51 am
It's a number of things, really.... either as combinations or on their lonesome. This could become a long post. Heh...
Let's see...
Female furs used to be very difficult to come across... though I still see very few coming out to furry gatherings in this region. Online, female furs have been growing in numbers quite dramaticly in the past few years or so. In the past, straight male furs have had little interest in gatherings since they can't really go and at least chat with someone of the opposite sex.
Furries often seek out mates from within the fandom, and the lack of females in the past has either caused some furs to 'switch' out of desperation or seek a life outside the fandom as they hunt down a female non-fur as a mate instead. Getting a life outside the fandom usually cuts down on one's ability to show up to meets.
When/if a gay furry couple gets together, there's no incentive to keep them from going to meets since they're both furry. Straight furs often have more social obligations outside of the fandom.
I've been witness to some rather ugly public displays from gay furs that have made straight furs uncomfortable from wanting to be in their company.
Well... That's a start. That's what I can remember off the top of my head for now.
Benjamin
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 12:32:07 am
Post by: Running_Wolf on October 25, 2003, 04:49:53 am
| Quote (Kome @ Oct. 25 2003, 12:32 am) |
| Wow. That really makes a lot of sense. Well I'm glad the shefurs like me are making a positive difference. |
In more ways than one...
Post by: Rikimaru on October 25, 2003, 12:31:11 pm
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 12:51:11 pm
Post by: Running_Wolf on October 25, 2003, 12:57:19 pm
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 01:51:35 pm
We may have to have a contest to take me out on a date!
Post by: Running_Wolf on October 25, 2003, 02:20:58 pm
MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEME!
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 02:28:43 pm
Post by: Otto Lontra on October 25, 2003, 05:35:31 pm
| Quote (Kome @ Oct. 24 2003, 10:38 pm) |
| Of course that's how it is! That's why I love forums. You can get to know people without knowing what they look like at all. That way you get to see inner beauty first! |
Aye, I agree with ya Kome.
Post by: Running_Wolf on October 25, 2003, 05:37:12 pm
| Quote (Kome @ Oct. 25 2003, 2:28 pm) |
| *bops him on the nose* Now now. It's not gonna be that easy. |
ow.
awwwwwwwww. I hate being single for too long
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 05:45:31 pm
Post by: Otto Lontra on October 25, 2003, 05:46:23 pm
| Quote (Running_Wolf @ Oct. 25 2003, 4:37 pm) |
| awwwwwwwww. I hate being single for too long |
I know how you feel Running _Wolf. I dun like being single either.
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 05:49:55 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 25, 2003, 07:49:10 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 25, 2003, 07:52:53 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 25, 2003, 08:06:24 pm
Post by: chimera soul on October 25, 2003, 08:10:12 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on October 25, 2003, 08:37:26 pm
Kome, your getting to experience one of the good and bad things about being a female fur, especially one who is flirtatious. The good thing is that you now have an endless supply of male admirers. The bad thing is that you now have an endless supply of male admirers. You may need to carry something around to bop them on the head sometimes when they become a Little to rambunctious.
Post by: on October 25, 2003, 08:43:25 pm
Post by: Kada-Ru on October 26, 2003, 01:36:24 am
Post by: on October 26, 2003, 01:39:54 am
Post by: Jackalman on March 28, 2004, 04:42:52 pm
Although, when I was a showcase slave in Toronto's S&M crowd I pretended to be at least bi-curious. But I never had any close physical/emotional relationships with men.
I think there's a reason why the furry world is viewed as mostly gay. I got online webcamming on Yahoo and all looking for a real female furry partner to chat with in furry costume and just, not for the life of me, couldn't find one.
There were tons and tons of men pretending to be female, and of course they would never webcam anything because the jig would be up. For the most part, it appears to be a boys-only playground. Maybe that's shifting which is why I'm delving again into the furry world, hoping to find online interaction with furry women.
I have surfed several times looking for porn sites dedicated to furry costume sex and found them to be exclusively gay. I'd like to hold a poll of my own and ask how many women really are genuinely interested in furry and furry erotica?
Post by: zackary_rainheart on October 28, 2003, 06:36:09 pm
*settles down on a grassy sunlite patch to watch the show.. geting a large pepporni pizza for myself.*
Post by: Rikimaru on October 28, 2003, 07:40:12 pm
Post by: Joel on October 28, 2003, 08:45:50 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 29, 2003, 02:53:16 pm
Post by: Running_Wolf on October 30, 2003, 01:34:25 pm
Post by: Lobar on October 30, 2003, 08:02:09 pm
Ah, but to be young and foolish again...Wait, I'm 17
*starts chasing after Kome*
Post by: Rikimaru on October 30, 2003, 08:30:18 pm
Post by: Lobar on October 30, 2003, 10:28:39 pm
*pats him on the head*
Post by: Rikimaru on October 31, 2003, 08:30:49 am
Post by: beyond the darkness on October 31, 2003, 02:16:33 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 31, 2003, 02:24:13 pm
Post by: beyond the darkness on October 31, 2003, 02:25:01 pm
Cool! Glad to here it!
Post by: Rikimaru on October 31, 2003, 02:37:44 pm
*sighs* oh well
Post by: beyond the darkness on October 31, 2003, 02:43:25 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 31, 2003, 02:47:20 pm
Post by: beyond the darkness on October 31, 2003, 02:48:27 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 31, 2003, 02:57:09 pm
Post by: zackary_rainheart on October 31, 2003, 04:31:49 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on October 31, 2003, 04:45:07 pm
either work for disney
or
be a concept artist ya no like in movies and stuff
Post by: Jy the Parrot on October 31, 2003, 09:21:47 pm
Post by: beyond the darkness on November 01, 2003, 07:59:54 am
Post by: Rikimaru on November 03, 2003, 11:52:00 am
Post by: RyoJintai on November 03, 2003, 05:03:31 pm
@ the main topic: I'm undetermined,seeing I'm young(13) and a virgin (for now) but I'm straight for all I know. But the first time I will get serious about it is probably 18 or 19, that's a ways' off. You may never know...you change over time.
Post by: CornishSkankRabbit on July 13, 2004, 11:45:06 am
Anything goes with me. Cept people with beards and weird medical conditions.
Other than that, let me at him/her/it.
Post by: Da_Bear on November 22, 2003, 06:35:45 pm
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 11:49:20 am
The sexually dimorphic nucleus alone has 5 or more variants (part of the brains physiology directly linked to sexuality and gender identification), none of which can be said to 'fit into' the kinsey scale."
Looks around at the staring furs and feels a little embarrased.
"Um... I can confidently tell you that I'm gay. Though I could probably ramble on about what that means to me for days."
Post by: Rikimaru on November 23, 2003, 12:07:53 pm
wow! dont be embarrassed, ur clever so show it off. lol. and how the hell did you find that all out anyways. and how can you ramble on about it for days! i could only go on 4 about 5 minutes lol. but im bad at putting things into words.
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 12:22:54 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on November 23, 2003, 12:30:34 pm
Post by: Varg the wanderer on November 23, 2003, 12:30:59 pm
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 12:31:41 pm
| Quote (Rikimaru @ Nov. 23 2003, 12:07 pm) |
| wow! dont be embarrassed, ur clever so show it off. lol. and how the hell did you find that all out anyways. and how can you ramble on about it for days! i could only go on 4 about 5 minutes lol. but im bad at putting things into words. |
I can rarely remember where i pick up bits of information... I just like to listen and watch and read. I like to watch documentaries (serious ones as opposed to the sensationalised ones
). My college had a good collection of professional journals and I have many friends and family members that are employed in scientific fields.I love to learn stuff!
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 12:34:06 pm
| Quote (Varg the wanderer @ Nov. 23 2003, 12:30 pm) |
| The bear was whacking pud? |
His tongue was involved more than his paw.
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 12:47:38 pm
The bible contains seven condemnations of homosexuality, many of which are debatable. It contains over 200 admonishments of heterosexual relations, again, many are debatable. The problem here is that the meanings have to be taken both in context and you have to be aware that even different denominations of catholicism interpret the bible differently.
What people most often quote as evidence of homosexuality as a sin is the story of sodom and ghomorrah(sp?). Though if you read the stories you will probably come to the conclusion that the sin commited was the sin of inhospitality. I dont believe theres a single reference to sex between men.
You can see the divide in the Protestant Church at the moment as direct evidence of this difference of interpretation. The bible is a good book to read (and the Qu'ran for that matter) if you approach it open mindedly enough to draw your own conclusions and notlisten to what someone else tells you it means. The stories are for the most part good moral fables, regardless of your actual religeon.
Post by: Rikimaru on November 23, 2003, 03:34:52 pm
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 04:23:46 pm
Well I get things wrong often enough too.
Post by: Manic on November 23, 2003, 09:09:50 pm
| Quote (Ursan @ Nov. 23 2003, 12:47 pm) |
| What people most often quote as evidence of homosexuality as a sin is the story of sodom and ghomorrah(sp?). Though if you read the stories you will probably come to the conclusion that the sin commited was the sin of inhospitality. I dont believe theres a single reference to sex between men. |
I don't mean to be a nitpicker, but I do feel the need to point this out; please read Genesis 19:4,5. Other versions say the same thing, and here's the NIV transcript:
(4) Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part fo the city of Sodom - both young and old - surrounded the house. (5) They called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them".
I'm not judging anyone, I'm just pointing out a material fact (law student
)
Post by: Ursan on November 23, 2003, 10:02:08 pm
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on November 24, 2003, 07:56:57 am
Christians and Homosexuality
(I do not believe any of the content linked to from this page is of an 18+ nature. However the site does deal with sexual issues so content on some other pages does cross the adult content line.)
There are many Christian denominations that support openly gay members. The Episcopal church just ordained it's first openly gay Bishop. There are many Christian theologians that do not view homosexuality as a sin. Just something to consider as you think about this issue.
Eating pork is something that we are told we are not to do in the old testament. So are those of us who eat pork today sinners?
This is a very hard issue to discuss without emotion. I am straight and married, but will strongly defend my fellow brothers and sisters rights to love who they will.
Personally, I believe there is too much importance and focused placed on sexual issues in religion by many. The New Testament has a clear message of love, forgiveness and compassion. God's compassion for his creation and the call for us to emulate his compassion in how we treat others. Right there is the mark of a good Christian or person, showing compassion to others.
Post by: Rohein on November 24, 2003, 01:07:03 pm
Post by: Ulario on November 24, 2003, 03:40:59 pm
I don't really trust religion much either. I follow a shamanistic path... and I've been told that I'm going to hell many times because of it. **rolls eyes** riiight. They can tell me that as many times as they want, but I don't believe it.
So yeah, I don't listen to either one of them.
And I do applaud all of you that can openly admit your homosexuality. While this gryph is straight (both in character and in real life), I do realize how hard it can be for someone to admit their sexual preference. (I've seen many people become unbelievable depressed or become alcoholic over that).
Post by: Ursan on November 24, 2003, 04:33:40 pm
Post by: Rohein on November 24, 2003, 05:04:38 pm
Post by: Ulario on November 24, 2003, 05:11:58 pm
Post by: honeywolf on November 24, 2003, 05:24:28 pm
Post by: Rohein on November 24, 2003, 05:28:04 pm
| Quote |
| we dont know whats gonna come when we die so lets just enjoy life |
Indeed. We do not and can not know, so we probably shouldn't spend as much time worrying about it as we do.
Post by: Rikimaru on November 24, 2003, 05:30:51 pm
"Yes I am against homosexuality, but even if you are gay, i think no less of you. Everyone deserves to live their life the way they choose."
I almost cried when she sed that to me cause it just showed me how much of a friend she is. It meant so much to me. I'm just glad she didnt run off as we were so close. Ok I'm gonna stop goin on about b4 i start cryin!
Post by: Ursan on November 24, 2003, 05:58:20 pm
Anyway... furries cant fight... the impulse to hug is too strong.
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on November 24, 2003, 06:22:05 pm
| Quote |
| Anyway... furries cant fight... the impulse to hug is too strong. |
| Quote |
| i'm bi and i love everyone, and dont get so heavy, we dont know whats gonna come when we die so lets just enjoy life |
Excellent attitude and philosophy.
And Rohein, your statement mirrors my beliefs as well on religion.
I grew up in a very conserative area with religious conservative relatives. Topics on morality and religion hit me hard sometimes because of my childhood experiences.
Post by: chimera soul on November 24, 2003, 06:39:39 pm
like they know what gods gonna do to us
Post by: Ursan on November 24, 2003, 07:07:03 pm
| Quote (Drake Blackpaw @ Nov. 24 2003, 6:22 pm) | ||||
Excellent attitude and philosophy. And Rohein, your statement mirrors my beliefs as well on religion. I grew up in a very conserative area with religious conservative relatives. Topics on morality and religion hit me hard sometimes because of my childhood experiences. |
My philosophy is that if theres an afterlife that'll be cool and all and we can all have a big party when we get there...
and if there isn't you wont really be in a position to care about it
Post by: Ulario on November 24, 2003, 08:01:12 pm
I had a grandfather that passed away about a year and a half ago, but my aunt (who is a lutheran) just recently got a dog. And she thinks the dog is the reincarnation of my grandfather because he does a lot of the same stuff that my grandpa used to do.
My mom was telling me this, and of course she forgot most of it... but I do know the one thing that she DID remember is the fact that the dog burps whenever he eats (my grandpa used to do that all the time).
Post by: Bear Paw on November 24, 2003, 08:43:06 pm
And Ulario intresting little story have heard a few similar things does make you wander hehe.
Post by: beyond the darkness on December 04, 2003, 08:17:55 am
Post by: Russano Greenstripe on December 04, 2003, 08:52:20 am
And about the sexuality, I really don't care. I suppose it's like gamers: some are bi, some straight, some gay. It really dosen't matter. I voted straight.
Post by: Tevnon on March 28, 2004, 09:53:21 am
Animal/human ratio is actually a larger consideration for me.
I'll try to list out the possibilities and what I feal about them.
Human female: Some are attractive. Strangely I find I can feal the whole range of romantic emotions for human females, but I'm sexualy uninterested. It's rather confusing.
Human male: Rarely will I find a human male attractive, and I've never wanted a relationship with one.
Female fur-no suit: Slightly stronger attraction than to human female. Not sure about the whole sexual issue.
Male fur-no suit:Perhaps a slight chance I could be swayed by one, but not much interest elsewise.
Female in fur-suit: OMG yes!
Male in fur-suit: Yes, but not quite as strong an attraction as females.
Female full anthro: Ideal. If it were possible such a mate would make me incredibly delieriously happy.
Male anthro: I would be happy with that.
Female animal body/sentient mind: Less interest than anthro or fur-suit, but I could develop fealings for such a creature(I had a crush on Nala for quite a while, actually).
Male animal body sentient mind: Nah, not really interested
Female animal:I would feal like crap if I did anything like that, though I could be tempted
Male animal:Not even close to interested.
Edit: Forgot to mention as I havn't been around other furries much I'm actually a 26 year old virgin, not that I havn't come close.
Post by: Rikimaru on December 13, 2003, 03:17:39 pm
Post by: on December 15, 2003, 07:31:51 am
Though I lean toward men alot more the woman.
Sorry, ladies. This man is a pole polisher.
Post by: Rikimaru on December 15, 2003, 12:06:33 pm
Post by: Russano Greenstripe on December 22, 2003, 12:37:07 pm
| Quote (Rikimaru @ Dec. 13 2003, 3:17 pm) |
| like gamers?! how? |
Well, if you looked hard enough, I'm positive you could find quite a bit of all three categories on any MMORPG.
Post by: on December 22, 2003, 05:34:09 pm
This was discussed ages ago on a place called Playbyweb.com It's a roleplay site. Pandorabox brought it up and it was discussed but it's no longer there.
Post by: Ursan on December 26, 2003, 06:57:45 pm
| Quote (Russano the Wise @ Dec. 22 2003, 12:37 pm) | ||
Well, if you looked hard enough, I'm positive you could find quite a bit of all three categories on any MMORPG. |
All the 'relationships' I roleplayed on MMORPGs were with female characters/players (and those were kinda spur of the moment too). So MMORPGs are a real bad comparison.
In a game people are usually roleplaying for the pleasure of roleplaying, not conducting actual romantic relationships (Because lets be honest a computer game is not a great environment for forging romantic relationships). Furrs here are dealing with their real lifes and are confined by their own feelings/personalities.
Post by: on December 26, 2003, 07:14:08 pm
Post by: Rohein on December 29, 2003, 03:01:09 am
| Quote |
| I suppose there's people of all three kinds on those kinda games. |
Of course there are. There are "people of all three kinds" anywhere you go, pretty much.
Post by: on December 29, 2003, 09:26:46 am
Heh. But seriously, it's different everywhere.
Post by: Ursan on December 30, 2003, 01:39:17 am
| Quote (Russano the Wise @ Dec. 29 2003, 12:35 am) | ||
Raef's right. I was talking about games like Dark Age of Camelot, Phantasy Star Online, and SOCOM: US Navy Seals. Though I'm not logged on one, I suppose there's people of all three kinds on those kinda games. |
I was speaking of experience with Dark Age of Camelot, Asherons Call, Asheron's Call 2, Anarchy Online, Star Wars Galaxies, Earth and Beyond and Neocron. (Yes I was quite an avid online gamer untill a year or so ago) Though I know a couple of people tried to form actual relationships in the games it never worked well at all, though if they'd had the good sense to log onto an instant messenger things would have been different maybe.
Same thing with several good friends of mine, I met em playing games but actually got to know then and befriended them out of the game. So the only real romances in a roleplaying computer game are being roleplayed.
No doubt the whole spectrum of people were there though
Post by: Pillowmint on December 30, 2003, 03:17:14 pm
| Quote (SoftFox @ Dec. 15 2003, 7:31 am) |
| I be a bisexual. Though I lean toward men alot more the woman. Sorry, ladies. This man is a pole polisher. |
This is where I stand as well, to be honest. Don't know why I put on the straight act for so long, I guess my upbringing (or lack thereof) just got the best of me.
Post by: firefox on December 31, 2003, 11:44:37 am
Generally, I try not to think about it too much.
The last time I seriously sat down and tried to figure myself out, I wound up in tears.
Maybe it's not even worth it.....
Post by: zackary_rainheart on December 31, 2003, 01:47:08 pm
| Quote (firefox @ Dec. 31 2003, 11:44 am) |
| Maybe it's not even worth it..... |
I wouldn't say that.
I never truely felt right about any relationship I was in till I accepted myself as gay.
And had I not done so or not let anyone in my life.. I would never found the happyness I have with Bormac.
No matter what the mix.. LOVE is always worth the effort.
And so is finding out who you really are inside.
Post by: Russano Greenstripe on December 31, 2003, 04:12:24 pm
| Quote (Ursan @ Dec. 30 2003, 1:39 am) |
| No doubt the whole spectrum of people were there though |
Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Finally, the bear understands! (just messing with ya, Ursan.
)
Post by: weiwardwulf on January 01, 2004, 12:51:09 pm
Tolerance and legal recognition of same-sex relationships is not enough. The lifestyle remains taboo, and this reshapes gay scene in ways people never think of unless they have been there. Same sex relationships come with so much extra baggage, that alone can put them on the rocks. Just one example is that you can't show affection in public without at least paying thought to who's around. You might think this is trivial, or "it would be a small price to pay if you really loved him," but it is not that simple. Like a handicapped friend of mine likes to say, "take a picture, it'll last longer."
Some truly good people find they can't face it on the day to day, so they may entertain affairs in private, or get involved with a MOTOS (to whatever degrees of success only they know), or simply remain alone. This causes some gems to drop off your radar screen, and then there are people of a less favorable sort. I'd not call them bad, really.... they are people who lack the balls to even try to keep a MOTSS relationship, yet they still want to scratch that itch. They don't want to know you, they just want in your pants for a one-night hookup. There are plenty of this sort on the same-sex scene, far more (to my experience) than on the straight scene. They give the lifestyle a bad rap as being centred on lust instead of love, and they are highly visible to newcomers. What a horrible first impression! Between the two types, it is real easy to get your heart bruised.
There is one more type I've seen (usually bi) for whom the lifestyle becomes a passing fad. They are inspired by the "hey cool, we're rebels" aspect and, though they might set out with good intentions, when thoughts of long-term practicality set in they let it slide.
I feel the whole landscape would be different if it wasn't for the societal pressure that steeps beneigh a veil of tolerance. It causes some to pull back from lifelong relationships, and others to seek satisfaction by prowling at night. Being gay ain't no frikken yellow brick road.
This is only my personal experience, living where I am. If yours has been different, please share your account and know that I'm glad for you.
Weiward Wulf
Post by: Tazurk_Halfdragon on January 01, 2004, 01:46:59 pm
Post by: Rikimaru on January 01, 2004, 03:07:41 pm
Post by: firefox on January 01, 2004, 03:19:27 pm
Post by: Funny Furry on January 01, 2004, 03:42:47 pm
I am bi and not afraid to admit it so there
Post by: Rohein on January 01, 2004, 04:25:30 pm
| Quote |
| They don't want to know you, they just want in your pants for a one-night hookup. There are plenty of this sort on the same-sex scene, far more (to my experience) than on the straight scene. |
I doubt it's really more than you'll find on the straight scene. Guys are brought up to believe that sex is better than a caring relationship. If you don't believe me, just watch any sitcom that contains men (and television often raises kids more than their parents do). Also, straight guys are generally more affected by these gender-role ideas than gay guys.
Post by: weiwardwulf on January 02, 2004, 08:37:33 am
Rikimaru, I've seen some of what you're talking about. People seem to judge based on stereotypical gay attributes (how you look, speak, dress, act). If you don't fit with what they've seen on TV, well to them you're not "really" gay. Many people don't fit the stereotype, some even try to adapt part of it to gain better recognition. Personally I don't fit at all except for one thing: I have a wide-shouldered, light-frame build like Will on Will & Grace, so I don't have too much trouble being accepted as something other than straight.
Rohein, that is certainly a possibility. After all, I don;t experience the straight scene from the vantage of a woman. Still, I stick by my statement based on experience, and what I've heard from my sister and others besides.
Weiward Wulf
Post by: on January 02, 2004, 09:13:25 am
One of my freinds has no problem with homosexual women. But he cannot stand homosexual men. He isn't the only, one, either, and it goes vice versa for a female freind.
Why is this? First off, I'd like to mention I doubt if they've actually met and known someone was homosexual, so I don't think that's it. But why is it OK for the opposite sex to be homosexual?
Post by: firefox on January 02, 2004, 02:34:55 pm
WHOO-HOO, did you ever pick the question to ask.
Where to start? Well, I can only answer for males, but.....
First off, most straight guys I know have absolutly no problem with lesbians (I think this has to do with the typical two-girls-for-one-guy fantasy)
They're uncomfortable around gay men because (in adherance to the stereotype) they feel it threatens they're masculinity. (this is a country where even young boys are taught to be little MEN)
Now I'm gonna go eat some red meat, gulp down a beer, and watch football.
*chuckles to self*
Post by: Rikimaru on January 02, 2004, 08:49:48 pm
And yea guys like lesbians for the whole threesome prospect. And they're jus scared of gay guys liking them. Dunno y they're scared though its like a compliment to say "hey you're cute" Then they get scared you're gonna try it on with them cuz they thing gay ppl are sex perverts and theyre NOT!!
thats my rant over
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 08, 2004, 11:08:49 am
| Quote (Raef Wolfe @ Jan. 02 2004, 9:13 am) |
| Something I always found curious. One of my freinds has no problem with homosexual women. But he cannot stand homosexual men. He isn't the only, one, either, and it goes vice versa for a female freind. Why is this? First off, I'd like to mention I doubt if they've actually met and known someone was homosexual, so I don't think that's it. But why is it OK for the opposite sex to be homosexual? |
In part, I think it is because accepting homosexualilty in someone of your own sex raises the issue in your mind about having a homosexual encounter yourself. This doesn't happen when seeing a couple of the opposite sex together.
The tendency to feel this way is more prominent in males as society has a harsher view of male homosexuality than female homosexuality. But as you mentioned Raef, there are definitely females who feel this way also.
I believe that most furries (not all) accept homosexuality in both sexes as it is prevalent in the fandom. To some, there is a if it feels good, why not attitude. I've heard this described as pansexual or omnisexual. There certainly is a healthy dose of that in the fandom as well.
Post by: Draska on January 08, 2004, 03:46:32 pm
Post by: bigbear on January 10, 2004, 09:25:15 am
Post by: Pillowmint on January 10, 2004, 03:28:39 pm
| Quote (firefox @ Jan. 02 2004, 2:34 pm) |
| (this is a country where even young boys are taught to be little MEN) |
Ugh, too true. I once watched a documentary called "Tough Guise" for a class last year. Basically, it talks about how men in America have been screwed up over so many generations by their fathers shoving masculinity down their throats as children and what we need to do to change this. I think it really points out all the gender problems of men in our society quite well.
Personally, my father stopped being a part of my life when I was about 7, and I'm glad because having him around could've turned me into the typical male stereotype, thereby making my existance completely unnecessary.
Post by: Rohein on January 11, 2004, 02:53:20 am
| Quote |
| Basically, it talks about how men in America have been screwed up over so many generations by their fathers shoving masculinity down their throats as children and what we need to do to change this. |
Personally I think women have been pretty well screwed up also. They're taught to keep up their appearance to an obsessive degree (the concept of make-up is simply insane). They're taught that men are supposed to do things for them (this has lessened in the past decades, but it still is very much alive). There are a lot of aspects of our society that still put women below men in some way.
I really dislike the idea of gender roles. I don't understand why people should be expected/made to do things just because they have certain parts.
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 11, 2004, 08:28:25 am
| Quote (Rohein @ Jan. 11 2004, 2:53 am) |
| Personally I think women have been pretty well screwed up also. They're taught to keep up their appearance to an obsessive degree (the concept of make-up is simply insane). They're taught that men are supposed to do things for them (this has lessened in the past decades, but it still is very much alive). There are a lot of aspects of our society that still put women below men in some way. I really dislike the idea of gender roles. I don't understand why people should be expected/made to do things just because they have certain parts. |
*Nods in agreement* Both genders have been pigeoned holed to certain jobs and roles in our society. Exceptions exist; male nurses, female astronauts, etc.., but many jobs are still at least subconsciously thought of as male or female. Still, America, Canada and most of the main European countries are much further along in these areas and are still progressing. I spent three years working for an Indian company, and while they still had some women in technical roles and in some leadership roles, it was very evident that a woman's opinion was valued less than a man's who was at the same level in the corporate structure. Not all Indians were this way, but enough to really highlight the cultural difference.
*Chuckles* As for things like make-up and high heels than many of us males don't understand, just remember that there are many women who love these things. They don't wear them because society says they have to, they do it because they enjoy it. It took me a while to accept that my wife actually liked make-up and high heels no matter how much she told me.
The genders are different. It's not just because of societial programming, there are differences in the body, brain and chemistry of the two sexes. This doesn't mean that either sex has to take on a particular role in society nor that an individual is better suited for one type of job over another just because of their sex. It is just a statement of fact that sometimes gets lost in this issue. The first wave of the feminist movement seemed to say that all women should be like the most aggressive males in the workplace and society. This was something many women didn't want and is something many men don't want to be either. Today's leaders of the feminist movement stress the ability for individuals of either sex to choose the role that they want and recognize that many women do want a more traditional female role and that is acceptable.
Post by: weiwardwulf on January 11, 2004, 11:39:32 am
I'd just add one comment: it bothers me how homosexuals automatically have the opposite gender's stereo-type associated with them. There certianly are people who more strongly identify with the opposite gender's identity, and these individuals may have a greater tendancy toward same sex relationships, but otherwise there is no correlation between preference and gender identity. Each person's case is unique, but all told a homosexual man is not "less of a man" in any way, neither in the case of lesbian women.
WW
Post by: Skunki on January 12, 2004, 02:17:44 pm
i really think that when i found furry, i found my true self. i honestly hate to call myself anything but straight because i fear rejection. but hey, what can one do? i think that i might as well be gay simply because i really don't want a girlfriend and i say i am bi because at one time, i did. but maybe it wasn't a girl, it was just love of anyone who cared. i don't think i could tell my friends, just because of all the gay jokes they make (that i get offended by, but i don't say anything about it). my friends brother is gay, and he seems to be one of the most used topics.
why? why does everyone have to be so closed on the subject of homosexual relations? i know it is looked down upon, and as a christian i realize it was one of the sins that soddom and gamorrah were destroyed for. but i don't seem to care more, even though i should. i sometime think to myself just to cheer me up, "this is how i am, people can like it or leave it. if my destiny is to be 'different', then so be it."
Post by: weiwardwulf on January 12, 2004, 10:14:55 pm
| Quote (Skunki @ Jan. 12 2004, 2:17 pm) |
| why? why does everyone have to be so closed on the subject of homosexual relations? i know it is looked down upon, and as a christian i realize it was one of the sins that soddom and gamorrah were destroyed for. but i don't seem to care more, even though i should. i sometime think to myself just to cheer me up, "this is how i am, people can like it or leave it. if my destiny is to be 'different', then so be it." |
Skunki,
I don't want to challenge your religious views, but I too am Christian (raised christian, tho I've borrowed much from eastern faiths). You have to realize there are very many prohibitions in the Old Law. These clustered around the core faith over centuries as people came and left their own "contribution." Jesus was different. He didn't come to fill pages and make the law more precise. He came to wipe the dust of centuries from the faith's central jewel.
It wasn't long after his crucifixion when people again started to "improve" the message. Now today some churches publish moral doctrine in the size of telephone books. I'm sure some are well intentioned and I'd not tell you to stop listening to them, but never forget the zenith of Jesus's words: Love God above all, love your neighbor as yourself.
He was crafty by putting two laws into the second: love your neighbor, love yourself. Straight or otherwise, God made you the way he did. It is your challenge to discover and accept yourself. Find and show genuine love where ever you can. Make your life an expression of love and you won't need to worry about being on God's bad side.
WW
Post by: Skunki on January 13, 2004, 08:50:01 am
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 13, 2004, 10:42:49 am
Jr high and High School is a time that any difference is picked on and made fun of by others. A lot of it is done because of peer pressure, not because they truely believe what they say. It dies down and goes away as you get older. You will definitely find College, if you go, a much more accepting place than school.
I personally don't see sexuality as a static thing. I have the occasional fantasy of playing with another male, but I am certainly more attracted to females when it comes to any type of relationship. Is there a label for that? *shrugs* I guess it just is.
| Quote |
| why? why does everyone have to be so closed on the subject of homosexual relations? i know it is looked down upon, and as a christian i realize it was one of the sins that soddom and gamorrah were destroyed for. but i don't seem to care more, even though i should. i sometime think to myself just to cheer me up, "this is how i am, people can like it or leave it. if my destiny is to be 'different', then so be it." |
Here is a link to a website from a Minister who graduated from Bob Jones University (you don't get more fundamentalist than that) that discusses the issue and states that the Bible isn't against homosexuality at all.
The Bible and Homosexuality
Soddom and Gamorrah was the Las Vegas/Tijuana of that day all wrapped up and on steroids. It was a place that focused only on pleasure and had forgotten the rules of hospitality and caring for others that were important in ancient society. That is why God destroyed it. There was no love in the acts that went on, just a search for pleasure. Homosexuality wasn't the issue.
Post by: Pillowmint on January 13, 2004, 10:49:33 am
Post by: Skunki on January 13, 2004, 11:20:02 am
Post by: User_of_Shadows on January 14, 2004, 12:59:05 am
I have just one thing to say tough. The Church just dislikes the fact that gay marrages cannot result in a child. But I say look at the women and men that are sterle(sp?) and cannot havve children(unless a miricle happens ,sometimes it does, but not much)
p.s. never take the bibble very litteraly is was written so that all can understand it but even how it was written was to complex for some Fundamentalist. It was written in words that is symbolic.
Post by: Russano Greenstripe on January 14, 2004, 04:00:50 am
I don't trust Christianity for two reasons: 1. It's too corrupt, and 2. They're extremists. Now, I understand that not all christians are like that, but a good 90% are. And the remaining 10% are probably furries. Now, the church is corrupt, because it twisted and turned the words of it's holy literature during the Roman and Medival ages, and it didn't tell the whole truth about it, and the won't today. They said that your family was stuck in purgatory unless you paid your way out, and the church used that money to build it's empire. They're also extremists, 'cause most of the wars of that time were over one of two things: Land, religion, or probably both. Heck, even today, they're still extremists. You tell a church-going person that you're a muslim, and I wouldn't be surprised if your @$$ was scattered from Taiwan to Timbucktu. And all this from a belief supposedly stemmed from a man who told us to love our neighbor.
Post by: Skunki on January 14, 2004, 05:27:57 pm
| Quote (Russano the Wise @ Jan. 14 2004, 3:00 am) |
| And all this from a belief supposedly stemmed from a man who told us to love our neighbor. |
Jesus did not pervert religion, it was society. the roman catholics had their own beliefsand i do believe that roman catholocism may have been one of the causes that some religions today believe the way they do (e.g. - only people of one paticular religion go to heaven). Jesus did not teach this though. so really it wasn't Jesus's fault that we have all of these wars. you must also take into consideration that when we have wars between religions, it may be because not all religions follow what Jesus said, eg "love your neighbour as yourself", and therefor really don't care about this statement. now, there is also a difference between loving and liking. we as christians are called to love everyone, but that doesn't mean we have to like them. so its still ok to have war. i believe that when there is no more war, we will be in the times of the beast.
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 15, 2004, 07:26:38 am
| Quote |
| p.s. never take the bibble very litteraly is was written so that all can understand it but even how it was written was to complex for some Fundamentalist. It was written in words that is symbolic. |
It is also important to note that much of the symbolism in the bible is lost on modern society because our culture has changes so much. My wife was watching a show on the life of Jesus and they raised an interesting example of this; the meaning of the phrase turn the other cheek.
In Roman times when Jesus lived, if you were slapped in the face it usually was done backhanded and was dissmissive gesture meaning that you were beneath the person who hit you or lower in society. A Roman soldier would backhand a peasent or master would backhand their slave to show displeasure. By turning the other cheek, you are making a statement of defience that says hit me with your forehand, i.e..strike me with the palm. Being slapped this way would signal that you are an equal of the person hitting you, not beneath them.
Today we look at that phrase and often interpret it as meaning just walk away, however it's really meant that you were suppose to demonstrate to authority that you were their equal and could not be treated as a lower class citizen.
Post by: Skunki on January 15, 2004, 06:05:38 pm
Post by: weiwardwulf on January 15, 2004, 10:07:20 pm
| Quote (Skunki @ Jan. 15 2004, 6:05 pm) |
| very interesting. i never thought of it that way, but now that you mention it everything makes sense. i don't think most of the words in the Bible are symbolic though. i believe that the parables that Jesus preached are, but no everything else. |
I think Drake's point is that language itself is symbolic, not only in terms of words but also in regard to expressions. We typically do not realize the extent to which this is true until we gain an outside vantage point on our own language, as happens when you become fluent in a second language. For a lesser example, you can read Canterbury Tales in the original text. It is our own language as it was some few centuries ago.
The Bible, no matter how noble a book, suffers the same shortcomings as the human tongue it is written in. It was probably a difficult thing for the prophets to cram the message into words they knew. Then it became an oral matter of remebering and respeaking until it was first penned. Then on to another set of hands centuries later to translate into Latin. If you've ever really translated anything, you know that it is an approximate hit-the-broad-side-of-the-barn undertaking at best. And finally translated again for the late middle english of King James, if that's the one you read.
In short, when you read words and verse from scripture as it is accessible to you today, you are looking down a long and compounded collidoscope of symbolism and interpretation. Its value is not diminished, tho it should be recognized for what it is.
Best advice I've heard from a scholar: take the whole work in context, never let an obscure passage dim the meaning of a clear one.
WW
Post by: TheIronMaiden on January 15, 2004, 10:21:37 pm
I wouldn't be suprised if they ended up passing this. I hate idiots; to bad the world is full of them.
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 16, 2004, 10:11:55 am
| Quote |
| I think Drake's point is that language itself is symbolic, not only in terms of words but also in regard to expressions. We typically do not realize the extent to which this is true until we gain an outside vantage point on our own language, as happens when you become fluent in a second language. For a lesser example, you can read Canterbury Tales in the original text. It is our own language as it was some few centuries ago. |
Yes, that is very close to what I meant. To expand upon it further, I also wanted to show that the actions someone took in biblical times often had a different meaning because of the cultural client of the time and the area than we give those same actions today.
So when someone took an action in the bible or were told to do something, it may be for a different reason than we would naturally think of today based on our current culture.
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| Uhh... disscussing religion depresses me. Anyway, has anyone else heared about this: http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news....] Since I don't have AOL, I wasn't able to get to this article. Can you give us a summary of it IronMadien? Post by: Wolfkin on January 16, 2004, 11:59:11 am Post by: TheIronMaiden on January 16, 2004, 01:28:04 pm
Oh, sorry. Didn't know non-AOL users couldn't view them. Anyway, it's an article about some conservative Christian groups that liked Bush's $1.5 billion initiative to help promote marriage, but don't think it's enough. Therefore, they are putting even more pressure on Bush to make a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage, but also they would like to see one banning same-sex civil unions from being recognized. Judging from the article, Bush stands to lose large numbers of votes if he does not support this amendment and some (but not enough) if he does support it. Anyway, here's the entire thing if you want to read it. (Jan. 15) -- Some major conservative Christian groups said yesterday that they were pleased but not satisfied by a new White House initiative to promote marriage, and they stepped up pressure on President Bush to champion a constitutional amendment prohibiting same-sex marriage in his State of the Union speech next week. "This is like lobbing a snowball at a forest fire," said Sandy Rios, president of Concerned Women of America, one of the largest conservative Christian advocacy groups. "This administration is dancing dangerously around the issue of homosexual marriage." The conservative Christians' insistence on an amendment to prohibit same-sex marriage may put President Bush in a political bind as he starts his re-election campaign, caught between wooing potential swing voters and turning out his core evangelical supporters. Some conservative strategists warn that pushing to amend the Constitution to prohibit same-sex unions could turn off some potential Republican voters like suburban women, who might find excessive talk about the perils of same-sex marriage as intolerant, mean-spirited or weirdly obsessive. "I think there are a lot of people that don't want to endorse a lifestyle contrary to their personal values, but they want to be tolerant," said Ed Goeas, a Republican pollster who is working with the Bush re-election campaign, "and quite frankly they don't like being put in a position where they look to be intolerant." Mr. Goeas added: "The president hasn't been hesitant at all in saying he thinks marriage is between a man and a woman, period. Questioning whether you need a constitutional amendment is another matter. Those are major actions." Mr. Bush's top political adviser, Karl Rove, citing polling data, has often said that he believed the failure of four million conservative Christian voters to turn out in the 2000 presidential election almost kept President Bush out of the White House. Projecting another close race this year, Mr. Rove has worked hard to stay in regular contact with conservative Christian political leaders. A coalition of several prominent conservative Christian political advocates from organizations like the Family Research Council and the Southern Baptist Convention said it had been urging Mr. Rove and others in the White House to persuade the administration to embrace an amendment blocking same-sex marriage. Some, including Concerned Women of American and the Family Research Council, said they also hoped for an amendment to prohibit states from recognizing same-sex civil unions. In his only public statement on same-sex marriage, President Bush left many evangelical leaders puzzled about his intention. In a television interview last month, Mr. Bush said he believed a marriage was "between a man and a woman" and that he would support a constitutional amendment "if necessary." But he also said that "whatever legal arrangements people want to make, they're allowed to make, so long as it's embraced by the state, or does start at the state level," and he emphasized the need for tolerance. Ms. Rios of Concerned Women of America said Mr. Bush had implicitly endorsed gay unions. "It is the same as saying the federal government doesn't want to weigh in on slavery, but if the states want to call it chattel that is O.K.," Ms. Rios said. Several prominent evangelicals said their concerns were not assuaged by a report that the White House was planning a $1.5 billion initiative to promote marriage. Gary L. Bauer, who ran on a traditional-values platform in the Republican primaries in 2000 and is now president of the conservative group American Values, said, "If the White House puts this on the back burner or doesn't put political capital into it, that would deeply demoralize a large block of voters that they are expecting to turn out in November." Several conservative Christians involved in the push for an amendment said they saw the State of the Union speech, when President Bush will lay out his agenda for the year, as a pivotal test. "Time is running out but the clock is still ticking," said Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council. Christian conservatives say they are puzzled at the administration's hesitation because prohibiting same-sex marriage appeared broadly popular, at least in the months since the highest court in Massachusetts ruled that the state had to recognize gay marriages. Opinion polls have shown more than 60 percent support the idea that marriage should be restricted to a man and a woman. Other prominent conservatives, however, argue that yes-or-no polls do not show how significant an issue might be to a voter. "Because it is a new issue, we don't know how it is going to affect votes cast for candidates," said Grover G. Norquist, a conservative strategist and the chairman of Americans for Tax Reform. Mr. Norquist said some potential Republican voters might be turned off by raising the issue to a constitutional level, just as they were by too much talk of guns or abortions. "Obsessions turn people off," he said. There are also gay Republicans to consider. About a million of them, or a quarter of the 4 percent of voters who identify themselves as gay, turned out for President Bush in the last election, Mr. Norquist said, citing polls of those who had cast votes. How Mr. Bush himself feels about the issue personally is also unclear. Mr. Bush has made no secret of his own born-again faith. But some gay Republicans say he appears far more friendly to gays than previous Republican administrations. The administration has invited leaders of two gay groups, the Log Cabin Republicans and the Republican Unity Coalition, to the White House. One of President Bush's longtime friends from Texas, Charles Francis, now heads the Republican Unity Coalition. At his inauguration, he sat near Mary Cheney, daughter of Vice President weiner Cheney, and her female partner. Ms. Cheney is now director of vice-presidential operations in the Bush-Cheney re-election campaign. In a debate in the 2000 campaign, Mr. Cheney spoke sympathetically of same-sex civil unions. "It's really no one else's business in terms of trying to regulate or prohibit behavior in that regard," he said. Last week, however, Mr. Cheney told The Denver Post that he would back any decision President Bush made on the question of an amendment. Post by: Skunki on January 18, 2004, 12:21:03 am Post by: Shadou Kitsune on January 18, 2004, 01:25:09 am but i do talk to some furs that say that they are gay... hmm... i hope this wouldn't make me gay... no it shouldn't make me gay... it's only by IM... AHHH!!! Self-doubt AHHH!!! i'm confusing myself!! *slaps self* woo.... i needed that... Post by: TheIronMaiden on January 18, 2004, 01:32:08 am
Copy and pasted it. It took about 6 copy/pastes because I didn't want to include the pointless little images within the article. Post by: morfran on January 18, 2004, 01:55:15 am
That reminds me of a quote I've heard: it's better to reign in hell than serve in heaven
Post by: BlueNinja on January 18, 2004, 04:12:10 pm Since your board doesn't like the way I'm used to quoting, it might look a little funny.Anyway ... other people have mentioned the 0-6 Kinsey scale, and I think I pull in at about a 1.5-2 ... I've had fantasies about being with another guy, but in reality, I've never met any guy I've been physically attracted to. It doesn't really bother me whether people are gay, straight, bi, or whatever. I'm a very live-and-let-live kinda person. Just so long as they can handle some teasing.
) then complain that gays scare them or give them the willies. It's all sort of ridiculous to me.
Post by: Skunki on January 21, 2004, 07:50:38 pm Post by: zwabbe on January 21, 2004, 11:54:00 pm Well I dont really know.. I think im Bi but wouldnt have a clue. its all too confusing for me.. Does anyone have any tips on finding out... Post by: Rohein on January 22, 2004, 12:00:46 am
Well, if you're bi, then that means you're attracted to both men and women. So, just picture various kinda of sex in your mind and figure out what turns you on. If homo and hetero sex both turn you on then you're most likely bi. Post by: zwabbe on January 22, 2004, 12:03:10 am Post by: zwabbe on January 22, 2004, 12:15:20 am Its just to much to handle, with School It wouldnt be very good being a BI furry and then if people found out it would make my life hell.. Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 22, 2004, 10:57:32 am You are young and at an age where sexual desire and identity start to form. Do not worry about labelling yourself at this time, and also do not worry that thoughts you may have make you one thing or another. Things will become more focused for you as grow older. Bi is sometimes used as a catch all phrase to describe people who are physically attracted to members of both sexes, to those that are mainly attracted to one, but can see being with the other as pleasurable. The second I don't see as being truely bi, it's just an understanding that touch feels good, no matter where it comes from. Right now, you are probably too young to know if your situation is the first or the second. Just be Zwabbe and don't worry. There is time enough in your life to do that later on.
Post by: zwabbe on January 22, 2004, 06:42:11 pm Post by: BlueNinja on January 22, 2004, 09:48:52 pm
Post by: Paul Cox on January 23, 2004, 01:02:52 am Honestly, sex and physical attraction are almost always the last things on my mind. The behaviouralist in me is often fascinated with the concepts, but I just can't relate to them personally. I tend to think of Love as nothing more than a good storyteller's device (or tragedian's, more likely than not). I guess I am probably mostly straight, but the point is a strictly academic one. I'd like to be able to say to females "just pretend I'm gay", and to males "just pretend I'm straight", and get the whole thing out of the way. IT'S JUST COITUS PEOPLE! I can't imagine it feels that much better than, say, a cold drink of fresh water on a hot summer day. Post by: Yip on January 23, 2004, 04:38:44 am
I'm actually kind of glad you brought that back up. I've been doing some thinking about it, and well, there are really two points I was trying to make there. And I think I probably let one distract from the other. (I have modified my second point, as I don’t think I was very clear last time.) The first point is that this attitude sounds somewhat hypocritical to me. Your saying that you would drop a friend in an instant if you suspected that they might drop a friend in an instant. Doesn’t that make you just as bad, no worse, than them? So then, if your friends are the same way, they should drop you in an instant for considering dropping them in an instant for thinking that they might drop someone else in an instant. *wonders if his point is made clear by being unclear.* You really should give your friends more of a chance than that. If you find out they really mean it, then I could understand. But you should at least let them know that you won’t stand for it first. Who knows, you might get them thinking. My second point is that you should look beyond the individual. This person is probably only acting how they think they are suppose to act. I know I used to believe that homosexuality was wrong because that’s what I was taught growing up. And they were probably taught that also. So much so in fact, that they are expected to stand against it. And before you go saying how they should think for themselves and such, let me ask you, are you completely unaffected by the society? Especially while you were growing up? I truly doubt it. If you say you are not affected by society then you’re probably overlooking something. And whatever you missed, well, why didn’t you think for yourself on that? Now, I’m not saying that you should agree with them or even that you should accept their behavior. But you should at least let them know where you stand before you just stop being their friend. And if you can get them to think about it maybe they will realize that they are wrong. (Maybe not, but don’t your friends deserve that chance?) Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 23, 2004, 01:39:55 pm
*Laughs* Water must taste extremely different where you live or have some amazing qualities to it. Seriously, the amount of pleasure derived from the act is different for everyone. Some of it is based on environmental and societal factors since much of pleasure is centered in the brain and some of it is straight physiological. *Shrugs* Some people do not have a strong urge for sex. It's hard to explain why it is a big deal to someone who isn't wired that way. I'm not saying that's bad or good, just that it is. Post by: Timber Fox on January 23, 2004, 04:28:16 pm I'd say I'm straight because I'm only sexually attracted to women, but I like regular physical contact from just about anyone/anything. I like it when people pet me on my head. Murr... =^-^= Post by: TheIronMaiden on January 23, 2004, 07:29:43 pm
I just reread my previous post, and I believe I came off sounding a little more unaccepting than I really am in the sentence in which I said I would have dropped him as a friend in an instant if he had not been my friend for so long when he said said "If I found out any of you were gay, I would beat the crap out of you." I still would have considered it in that stated scenario, but not as rashly and extremely as I may have eluded to within my original post. I apologize for any confusion. But also, as BlueNinja had said, that sentence was also based upon the fact that he threatened to beat me up. That isn't nessessaraly the most friendly thing to say to someone. Also, you did change the wording. You said "...drop a friend in an instant if you suspected they would drop a friend in an instant." One, I never used the word suspected. Also, I did not say I would stop being his friend if he stopped being someone's friend because they were gay, I said I would've drop him as a friend in an instant: (a) because he threatened me personally, or (b) if he beat someone up or made fun of someone, based soley on their sexual preference. Finally, as I said in my previous post, he IS still my friend. As for your second point, I accept eveyone's beliefs. I don't care what people want to believe, it's their beliefs and their right to believe whatever they want. When people bring violence (phyisical or verbal) into the picture because of their beliefs though, that is when I feel they have overstepped their bounds. As for am I unaffected by society, I frequently sit down and do nothing but contemplate all of my beliefs to make sure they are truely what I personally feel, with no other influence, whatsoever. Post by: Yip on January 23, 2004, 11:05:02 pm
Although neither you nor BlueNinja used that word, I was using it to illustrate my point. It was really the rashness of it the bothered me. If, as BlueNinja said, he would drop them "in a hot second", he's obviously not taking the time to really understand the situation and therefore all he would have at that point would be suspicions.
Again, I was going off what BlueNinja said "If one of my friends was talking about beating someone up..." The "someone" implies that the one being beat up is probably not you, and "talking" does not sound like it was necessarily very harsh. Like you said in you original post, you didn't think he would go though with it.
Post by: Skunki on January 24, 2004, 12:37:29 am Post by: zwabbe on January 24, 2004, 08:34:41 am I know that a couple of my closer friends wouldnt care..but only about 2 of them.. the rest would just cause problems.. Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 24, 2004, 11:01:02 am
I was listening to a Jewish scholar talk about the 10 commandments on NPR and he stated that Judisiam certanly does not see all sins as equal, even the 10 commandments. The punishment given out for breaking a commandment was different depending on which one it was, showing that even with those 10, a difference was noted. Remember, all of these rules originated in the old testament under the Jewish religion. It was also noted that the word commandment is a mis-translation of the original Hebrew. It is more accurately translated as the 10 words or 10 utterances, not commandments. Post by: Skunki on January 24, 2004, 10:43:27 pm Post by: Skunki on January 24, 2004, 10:46:10 pm
its just the teenage thing to "bash" what is different. but from what i have heard, college is a lot more accepting. Post by: Rohein on January 24, 2004, 11:04:43 pm And yeah, college is a lot better than high school. But it also depends on what college. For example, Skunki, if you went to a Christian college it would likely still be a bad idea to come out. Post by: Skunki on January 24, 2004, 11:07:53 pm Post by: Skunki on January 24, 2004, 11:55:29 pm Post by: TheIronMaiden on January 25, 2004, 01:44:33 am
Odd? Not really. There are a good amount of people at my school (homophobes and non-homophobes) that do this same thing.
That doesn't sound like it went over too well. I am quite vocal at my school about how I feel toward homosexuality, but I don't go to a Christian school, so I don't have to worry about how others may feel about it. Post by: Drake Blackpaw on January 25, 2004, 07:20:52 am
Stereotypes, such a wonderful thing. I know many people who are gay and only a few display the mannerism associated with being "gay". I mean a lot of them don't even have any fashion sense at all. (Bad joke, I know. My wife has made me watch too much Queer Eye for the Straight Guy). *Shrugs* Much of this behavior comes out of ignorance, unfortunately most people just enjoy being ignorant. It's so damn easy.
*Hugs* Sorry to hear that. I know it doesn't help now, but once you are out of school and on your own you will be able to find a group of people where you can be yourself. I think one of the hardest thing about the late teens is that you begin to find your identity but don't have the power to change your environment to fit it. Just hang in there Skunki. It does get better. Post by: Skunki on January 26, 2004, 11:38:22 pm Post by: Rohein on January 27, 2004, 12:10:53 am
Heh, I have a decent sense of fashion, but I would hate being fashionable.
Post by: Pillowmint on January 27, 2004, 04:37:27 am Post by: Skunki on January 28, 2004, 06:44:58 pm there is this really (and i mean really) homophobic kid at my school. so today, me and this other kid went up to him and started "petting" him. after saying stop several times and me still persisting in my efforts to annoy him, he got up and punched me. anyway, i was leaving the room because i then realized he was trying to study for a chemistry test. then the chem teacher walked in (he is a short old man which is why this story is funny to me). i asked him to go pet my friends arm and he did. it was the funniest looking thing i had ever seen. my other friend and i just started cracking up. Post by: BlueNinja on January 28, 2004, 09:30:34 pm
Post by: Skunki on January 28, 2004, 11:49:08 pm Post by: Rikimaru on February 09, 2004, 05:12:43 pm
Hey! I can relate to that. I don't really get bashed, but by now most of my year/grade/whateva are mature enough to deal with it. sure you get the odd one or two assholes but thats natural. When i was first 'discovering' myself, i was put off everything, but only a few people noticed. I guess the major thing was that i wasnt eating much. but i got over that soon enough. But if you stay in the closet it starts to hurt after a while. well it hurt me i dont know how you guys get affected by it. But i just told my closest friends to build up a little confidence in myself, then i told a few more friends, then i blew my whole cover completely by askin a strait guy out. Ok i didnt know he was strait at the time but thats how word got out. most ppl accepted it, just a few annoyances but i just ignore them. Im suprised my parents havent found out yet lol. Post by: Drakalu on February 17, 2004, 09:33:01 pm I am straight though I have many gay friends and at many times in my life people have assumed I was gay. Eh... yes I am in touch with my feminine side though I do not have any sexual urges towards those of the same gender. As long as certain rules are followed I am fully comfortable and would prefer my openly gay friends to be themselves around me. DragonDanceR, hopefully our paths will cross more in the not too distant future. I have read many of your posts and feel the same way you do about a great deal of subjects. Brightest Blessings, brother. Post by: Jybian on February 19, 2004, 08:56:12 am Post by: Calico McKillian on February 20, 2004, 02:43:26 pm i want very much to have a furry mate .. but have never had one.. i think it would be interesting at best lol .. but it really would be much better to have that understanding. Post by: Ursan on February 27, 2004, 08:51:21 am Post by: on February 28, 2004, 08:12:45 am I was at drama 2 nights ago. It was inbetween scenes and I was backstage. There were whispered conversations as always, but I wasn't a part of them, nor was I listening. I was sort of staring at the floor, which was black and hardwood, nothing special there. Wasn't thinking about much, other than 'Gods, this is boring...' or other things. Suddenly, it just sort of popped into my head and lots of things clicked into place suddenly. I'm bisexual. I went through a period of about a half hours self denial over the matter, then I got into a conversation about the musical with David, who's very gay and is very open...he basicly walks up to you and says, "Hello, my name is david, and I'm gay! Some of my interests are...". Well, people treat him great and don't give him a hard time over it, actually, most people don't even care or bring it up. So I realised there was nothing wrong with it, really, it was just...weird and different. I've only told 4 freinds so far...2 canadian ones over the net and 2 real life ones....but...they were all guys and they only thing that might change their tudes would be the possibility of a g/g relationship and most guys seem to think that's hot anyway I haven't told any girls, afraid of how they'll react.Any suggestions on the matter? Post by: Rohein on February 28, 2004, 05:48:39 pm
Unless they're religious extremists, they'll likely be fine with it. Of course, you still don't need to tell them unless you're ready to.
Post by: Ursan on February 28, 2004, 07:44:28 pm Few women I know are uncomfortable with it and none i know hate it. I guess what I'm trying to say is that really you should be more uneasy telling guys than gals
Post by: snarfle on February 28, 2004, 07:46:16 pm Post by: Rohein on February 28, 2004, 08:18:43 pm
Um, zoophilia has nothing to do with fursuit sex (and there's no special term for it other than "fuirsuit sex" as far as I know).
Yeah, women are generally more accepting of gay/bi people. Though mostly guys seem to have problems with other gay/bi guys, not with women (unless it's based on religion, that is). Post by: Rikimaru on February 29, 2004, 09:01:51 am
I can back that up, I'm friends with loads of girls cuz they're just easier to talk to. But guys do have a thing for lesbians tho, why? What is the whole amazing thing about it? Maybe str8 guys are too horny LOL . But you shud be more easy around girls i guess, just dont let the girl you're attracted to know you are until you're confident about it all though.
Post by: on February 29, 2004, 01:33:23 pm That's gunna be impossible. They already told us that if either of us ended up being gay they wouldn't support us  So, now does anyone have any good ideas? I've been told the following: 'You're a teen, you probably aren't bi.' WRONG!!!! 'You could talk to a counselor.' I don't trust em, plus, I don't know my counselor at school. 'Talk to an adult you know.' Yeah, my parents. Or my family that lives an hour plus away. Woot....not. 'Call a hotline/ go to a local support groups/etc' My city's about a mile wide. It ain't gunna work. 'Talk to any gay freinds you might have about how their families took it.' My only gay freind I never see Other than net ones, which is thus why I am here.
Post by: Rohein on February 29, 2004, 04:08:02 pm
If they said they'd stop supporting you, I'd say don't tell them until you can support yourself. It kinda sucks being in the closet, but it's better than being out on the street. Of course, if you have any other relatives who'd be willing to support you (I wouldn't count on this, but I suppose it's possible) then you could turn to them. Post by: Rikimaru on February 29, 2004, 04:55:59 pm Post by: Zero on February 29, 2004, 05:11:39 pm Post by: on February 29, 2004, 05:52:51 pm Now THERE'S a highlight! LOL.Closets suck :P I would really like to tell them ASAP, but I'll wait till I get more opinions. Post by: Ursan on March 01, 2004, 10:35:55 am
I know a lot of straight women get hot under the collar for guy/guy stuff too. Post by: Drake Blackpaw on March 01, 2004, 01:57:57 pm
Yes, the closet does suck. However, I would seriously think about what you would do if your parents react poorly and weigh that against the benefits you would receive by being open to them. Would life change that much? Just something to think about. I'm 35 and made the mistake of telling my mother something about me that put a huge strain on our relationship. I really wish I hadn't told her, but I can't take it back. I live far away and have the ability to just not deal with my mother. You live with your parents and need to deal with them everyday. Legally, they can't kick you out of the house, but they sure can make life a living hell while you are there. Good luck, whatever you decide. Post by: on March 01, 2004, 02:50:06 pm "Yeah, women are generally more accepting of gay/bi people. Though mostly guys seem to have problems with other gay/bi guys, not with women (unless it's based on religion, that is). I can back that up, I'm friends with loads of girls cuz they're just easier to talk to. But guys do have a thing for lesbians tho, why? What is the whole amazing thing about it? Maybe str8 guys are too horny LOL . But you shud be more easy around girls i guess, just dont let the girl you're attracted to know you are until you're confident about it all though." It's the whole, "Woah! Two girls and no guys! HOTTT!!!" issue. Trust me, I asked one of my male freinds that
Post by: Rikimaru on March 01, 2004, 06:06:08 pm
ahhhh LOL. i see now. i think any parents that kick their own child out of their house, for whatever reason, should never be parents. thats just wrong. well i know that my best friends parents will prolly take me in, they say im welcome any time. so i guess im ok. now its just the problem of telling my parents. i dont know when i will and i dont know how to. do i just drop it in a conversation? do i have a family gathering, should i talk to another adult first? its too confusing for me to worry about at the moment so im gonna wait until i finish my finals in june before i think about anything like that, exams are enough strain on my mind without that. Post by: Elscire on March 02, 2004, 04:33:33 pm I say better because there's never going to be a good time =\ Post by: TheIronMaiden on March 03, 2004, 09:00:41 am Therefore, I've decided to refuse to think about my sexuality again, and just believe I'm straight. Yeah, I know, that's a pretty ignorant stance, but I really don't want to be anything but straight. I strive to be different in almost every way, but this is the ONE area in which I am really hoping to be in the majority. Anyway, if I am bi, I calculated that the greatest degree to which I would be is 80% straight and 20% gay. *shakes head* I don't know. I guess that's all I can say at the moment; I gotta get to school.
Post by: Calico McKillian on March 03, 2004, 01:15:15 pm Post by: on March 03, 2004, 02:55:41 pm I can see why you'd try and deny it. I myself tried to. And I'm not even 50/50; I'm more around 60/40 or 65/35 actually. I was also thinking whether or not I was serious when said it, (like, 'woah, this isn't true...is it? I feel sttratcion rto one maybe two people...nah, it's just the exception' but I am. This is rather like my trying to convince myself I was a christian at one point when I feared I wasn't: I realised that I don't behave like a christian does nowadays, and I don't follow all of what God tells me to. I now find this to not be a bad thing
Post by: Rikimaru on March 03, 2004, 03:28:39 pm Post by: Pillowmint on March 03, 2004, 08:24:46 pm
I second that Anyway, after reading this thread a little more, it reminds me of something my best friends told me about a study that was done on gays who were still in the closet. Apparently all the stress of being in the closet triggers many physical problems; much more than those who were out of the closet (which would explain a lot in my case) I'm out of the closet to pretty much everyone except my family, who are assholes anyway. Post by: Yume on March 05, 2004, 01:53:40 pm Post by: Zarathus on March 12, 2004, 07:34:39 am
Eh...having homophobic parents isnt very...nice at all. My dad gets all annoyed at me if i even say anything about gay or bi people not being just so very evil, like he seems to think. Post by: Elscire on March 15, 2004, 12:21:28 pm
My father is the same, he's rather an intolerant person, yet somehow i thank him for it, because to bear witness to his intorerance has perhaps allowed me to become quite the oposite. A negative role model, if you will. Post by: Jybian on March 15, 2004, 01:47:23 pm , I'm just sorry they couldn't have been more open minded. *gives out sympathy hugs and snuggles to those who need them* Post by: Draska on March 15, 2004, 03:31:26 pm
Post by: Heyblibber on March 17, 2004, 01:18:33 am Post by: zwabbe on March 17, 2004, 07:27:15 am
Same here.. Started off bi and slid across
Post by: Rikimaru on March 17, 2004, 04:55:21 pm Post by: Kale on March 18, 2004, 06:42:29 am Post by: Rikimaru on March 18, 2004, 05:11:39 pm Post by: Kale on March 19, 2004, 01:21:08 am Post by: Jybian on March 19, 2004, 05:14:47 am Kale I know exactly how you feel, I myself think I', straight but that may be because I never really thought about going out with guys, now that I have I'm not entirely sure *hugs kale* here's to finding out just exactly how we work.
Post by: Rikimaru on March 19, 2004, 04:04:11 pm Post by: Draska on March 21, 2004, 11:59:49 am Post by: Ursan on March 25, 2004, 06:25:55 pm
I dont think its really a matter of contemplation and introspection. I think its more likely that psychologically you're still trying to find your place in the 'sexual spectrum' and eventually it will become glaringly obvious where your attractions lie. I think all you need to do really is be very careful that you are comfortable with any choices you make. Certainly dont go trying things on the off-chance that you might like them
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on March 28, 2004, 10:21:04 pm
My SO, who is definitely female was the owner of the Tavern on Taps and won a contest with some furotica that she wrote. Some of the best furry artists that do "yiffy" or sexual pictures are female, including J (Jessica) Willard, Huskie, Dark Natasha and Ayame.. Now I haven't heard any females interested in sex while in a fursuit, but then there aren't that many furs who are interested in it no matter what there orientation or gender is. They do exist, just remember that approximately only 20% of the fandom is female at the moment. Post by: Berren Norjhan on April 06, 2004, 11:01:37 pm Post by: Rikimaru on April 07, 2004, 06:29:08 pm Post by: KiyoshiAkita on April 10, 2004, 10:57:02 pm Post by: Bear Paw on April 16, 2004, 07:21:18 pm Post by: Yume on April 17, 2004, 01:18:44 pm Anyway, since then I've gotten over it and I fully accept myself for what I am.
Post by: SatisWindpaw on April 17, 2004, 02:32:10 pm
*checks* Nope, still a female. Oooh, I'm a rarity! Heh. Anyway. In answer to the topic of this thread, I'm bi, and have been since I can remember. When it suddenly became unacceptable for people of the same gender to give each other valentines on Valentine's Day in school (about fourth grade in my school), I was confused and terribly saddened, because I didn't understand why anyone would make a rule. I'd thought everyone was allowed to like whoever they wanted to. Kinda sucks to also be living in South Texas, cos even just innocently complimenting someone of the same gender gets you funny looks, and from some of the less civilized, threats. On the other hand, my mate, who doesn't like gays/lesbians/bis/whathaveyou (though he has no problem with the people, just the idea), is getting kinda used to the fact that when a pretty woman crosses the street, we both end up looking. Sometimes he forgets, though, and gets the funniest facial expressions... Oh, should also mention that I keep the matter quiet while at my dad's house, because they've threatened to disown me if I ever brought a girl over there. Guess they're lucky, the one girl friend of mine I wanted to see if I had a chance with more than any other female in the past, ended going up with one of our guy friends before I could ask her. Though it's a good thing, since that meant I was still free when my mate came along. Post by: Prince Karo on April 17, 2004, 03:27:04 pm
Post by: Pillowmint on April 17, 2004, 05:04:16 pm
Yeah, I've totally been there. I had kind of a reputation for being a homophobe back in freshmen year of high school, but alas, is how my mom raised me. After then, I made friends with a few who were bi, so I came to get over it. Just another way that parents can mess up their kids, I suppose. But it's better now that I've accepted myself for who I really am.
Post by: Yume on April 21, 2004, 04:20:34 pm Post by: on April 21, 2004, 04:35:51 pm Furry? Yes. Furry Erotica? >< Noooooooooooo......... "Oooh, I'm a rarity!" w00t for femme furs! We need more of us
Post by: SatisWindpaw on April 22, 2004, 12:29:25 am
I just had the idea to start making one of those pokemon card game parodies, only to feature Furtopia Users instead of pokemon. And by the looks of the numbers of girls to guys here, I'm thinking that we females could be rares, if not holofoils *geeks out ever-so-slightly, and giggles* *works on her card, just to say she did one* Post by: kitty on April 23, 2004, 02:00:27 pm
I was on one of those type of boards one from my home state mind you(IA), and felt very much unwanted, It really hurt my feelings. I made just a few posts and the admin jumped down my throat and called my ideals inmature, and perty much told me in a very long tecinical speech females were not wanted there. And they didn't apreciate the type of art I made. So bleep them! I hope his board dies. The prick GRrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr...........Post by: Bladewolf Carlile on April 28, 2004, 07:28:56 pm Back on the topic...the polls had shown that its more half and half currently, even though despite the prediction I actually thought there may be more straights at least around 65-70% Post by: Rosalie on April 29, 2004, 11:37:33 am Post by: SalemFuchs on April 30, 2004, 09:51:25 am Post by: nigirimeshi on April 30, 2004, 06:25:16 pm Post by: Kris Fox on May 01, 2004, 02:59:33 am I do have many gay,bi m/f friends though. Hmmm.... now that I think about it I think I'v got more friends that fit the gay/bi catigory than the straight catigory Anyway, I can understand the various "aspects" of what some doub "alternative life styles". Open mindedness ROCKS
Post by: leo wolfe on May 01, 2004, 02:40:47 pm Post by: on May 05, 2004, 12:46:04 pm Post by: Rohein on May 05, 2004, 01:09:27 pm Post by: Rikimaru on May 05, 2004, 04:38:25 pm Post by: Pillowmint on May 05, 2004, 06:04:03 pm
There really is nothing wrong with being a virgin. Problem is that human society has a way of making one feel that they have less value as a person (or fur, or whatever) if no one wants to bang them. It's really quite sad. Post by: on May 05, 2004, 06:30:46 pm Post by: Pillowmint on May 06, 2004, 03:50:35 am
I've heard similar crap too, but it definitely differs from person to person. I'm almost 20 and my sex drive just keeps getting stronger. Sorry for the over-share; just trying to get a point across
Post by: Ukiko on May 06, 2004, 04:01:05 am
Hm, 26 and counting. I prefer to think I just have high standards. There's been lots of times I could have if I really wanted to. I just feel that that should be special, with someone you truly love. *shrug* And I'm not really embarrassed to say I am, but sometimes people's reactions.....
Post by: on May 06, 2004, 09:27:54 am Post by: Pillowmint on May 06, 2004, 04:57:40 pm
I can't speak for everyone of course, but I doubt you have to worry about others' reactions here. Post by: Ukiko on May 07, 2004, 12:51:10 pm
Heh, yea, that's one of the reasons I've always liked this place.....
Post by: Yume on May 07, 2004, 01:40:54 pm
Post by: Lascivus_Lutra on May 07, 2004, 01:48:38 pm Post by: Blade Dance on May 07, 2004, 02:02:49 pm Virgin! I was one until I was married, and I was in the Navy for heavens sake! Imagine that, a young single sailor who is a virgin throughout his career! Don't feel bad Kradshade! Its worth the wait for someone special! Trust me! As for being identified, I would have to say I am straight! Though I have many friends that aren't. *ponders* Though there are moments, I feel that if they tried to seduce me, I probably wouldn't fight them! They are good trusting friends.
Post by: on May 07, 2004, 02:49:25 pm Post by: Lascivus_Lutra on May 07, 2004, 03:20:53 pm Post by: Ursan on May 09, 2004, 03:38:46 pm
Personally if my parents put that kind of proviso on my inheritance i'd bury it with them Not that I'm gonna inherit anything from my parents
Post by: Kassandra_Haymer on December 09, 2004, 02:00:32 am Yes. I know - I'm such a poser =P In my experiance though, a lot of internet users are gay, bisexual or openminded straight. Probably because they dont actually admit to being 'different' in real life from peer pressure and so forth. Anyway, since furry has become based (by nessesity) a lot on/around the internet, isnt it kind of inevitable that a lot of furries would be openly gay/bisexual? :..2-2-7..: Post by: on June 07, 2004, 01:29:36 pm Post by: Kattywampus on June 07, 2004, 01:46:20 pm Post by: Rikimaru on June 07, 2004, 05:13:56 pm Post by: BlueFox on June 07, 2004, 08:39:19 pm Post by: GothicFox on June 08, 2004, 04:46:34 am Which means I wish I could vote again... I used to heavily deny myself and was really hard on myself for a long time. But now I'm finally beginning to face the facts and realizing the truth ain't so bad.
Post by: SalemFuchs on June 08, 2004, 09:10:35 am
But I like KradShade's avatar... Post by: on June 08, 2004, 02:58:26 pm "Yaaaaay for non self denial! Post by: Rikimaru on June 08, 2004, 04:27:42 pm
YAY BLUEFOX! good idea, i was like that and then i just faced facts....not that i'm trying to put you off the idea of being bi or anything hehehehe Post by: Kattywampus on June 08, 2004, 07:52:01 pm Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 09, 2004, 01:17:53 pm Guess who? *murrs* I've always known I was straight. It allows me to appreciate a lovely sight like this brown kitty cat right here. Still, since I joined the fandom, most of my friends (maybe 60% of them) are gay or bi. It doesn't bother me, though, not even when they tease me mercilessly. I regret not waiting, but I won't make that mistake next time. The next time I make love it will be with someone I love. Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 09, 2004, 03:10:34 pm
*Laughs* I think that's the one of the most off color post I've seen you make. I don't agree with it though. First, You can be attracted to the same sex but not find that act particularly pleasurable. You can also find sexual play with the same sex pleasurable while not having an innate attraction to the same sex. I think being, bi, straight or gay denotes having a strong physical attraction that arouses desire to someone of the same and/or opposite sex. That isn't exactly the same thing as whether you find sexual play with someone of the same/opposite sex pleasurable. Post by: Rikimaru on June 09, 2004, 03:56:30 pm
i totally agree with ya there Drake Post by: Patrick Rangerwolf on June 09, 2004, 04:05:29 pm Post by: Rikimaru on June 09, 2004, 05:34:06 pm Post by: on June 09, 2004, 09:11:16 pm Welllllllllllll...no. I'm bi and all, but I can't picture myself "with" a female. *shrugs* Dunno why, just can't.Me, I just like people, male or female. I don't look much at bodies. I look mostly for personality. Post by: Rohein on June 11, 2004, 03:33:05 pm
It would have surprised me if the dictionary had listed them as different things. They're used to mean the same more often than not, but that's simply because most people are unaware of what gender really means. Sex = What parts/genes you have, whether you're physically male or female. Gender = Your self-identity, whether you feel you're subjectively male, female, other, or none. Post by: Bastian on June 10, 2004, 12:02:27 am *Blink*Blink* Point of Order: How can someone claim to be Bi-SEX-ual when they won't have sex with both genders? I mean, I could be way off base here, but being BiSexual means that you have sex with both genders in the same way that homosexual and heterosexual mean that you have sex with the appropriate gender for each type. Now, you may have snugglebuddies or be really, really close friends with someone of your own gender, but unless you find them sexually attractive, you're not bi-SEX-ual. Maybe I'm just too 0ld-sk00l. Post by: Kattywampus on June 10, 2004, 02:33:49 am Oh how you make me blush! =*^_^*= Bastian, That's kinda what I was hinting at when I made my most off-color comment in history. ..(hahaha, sorry) The rest of y'all (cont'd. from the end of the last part), But yeah. There's all different kinda love. But sexuality refers to who you'll boink(and who you'll let boink you)...and if you like it or not. Post by: on June 10, 2004, 01:38:53 pm Please keep in mind this is all in MY circle of friends (and quite an eccletic group it is).... I know some gay (btw, did you know that the original definition of gay was happy?! I'll bet ye did!) people who are verbally prejudice against "breeders" (as they call them), but who's closest friends are those same breeders they verbally slander. This does not make them bad people, it makes them human. The precentage of homo/bi/hetor people in group does seem to flutuate a lot, but it does not bother me. I notice that the younger generations are less worried about disguising who they are, though may do so around family (and not around friends). A sign of our evolving beliefs? Perhaps, or maybe it is just that it's all over the news (TV, Newspapers, Internet) and makes it easier to be open about their sexual preferrance. The ratio of furry faeries (as I prefer calling homosexuals) to human breeders (adopting a faery term for a moment) does not, in my circle of associations seem to favor one or the other. I have as many Faery human friends, as I do Faery Furries, and furry faeries, and human breeders... and now my train has been derailed.. oh yes... Open discussion of sexuality being limited to boards must happen more often around other circles of associations, because no one who ever sat in on one of my circles could ever say sexuality was not openly discussed..nor religion..society..or anything else for that matter.... Anyway, that's my take from my circle of associations. Other people have their takes on this issue, I do understand, but among my friends everything is openly talked about, and everyone is open about their sexual orientation, as well as religious beliefs, and social ineptitude (in some cases). Among my friends I encourage such clamour, because if ye can't talk about it around your friends, who else can you talk about it around?! Post by: Rohein on June 10, 2004, 07:56:27 pm
Actually this definition is not correct. Sexual orientation is not the same as sexual behavior. Being bisexual means being attracted to members of both sexes. Who you have sex with doesn't affect your define orientation (although in most cases is it a safe assumption that someone has sex with whatever sex type they're attracted to). Also use of the term gender is incorrect. Sexuality refers to the sex you are attracted to, not the gender.
Yep. Physical stimulation is pretty much the same no matter who's doing it to you. Your body doesn't know what's stimulating you and it probably doesn't care. However, if you have a strong psychological distaste for being with a certain sex, that could block you from acknowledging the pleasure. Post by: Bastian on June 11, 2004, 12:18:19 pm
Saying... "I only have sex with girls but I'm attracted to guys so I'm Bi." Is kinda like saying... "I only eat vegetables but I like the smell of meat so I'm an Omnivre."
*Blink* *Blink-Blink*
So what definition of Sex and Gender are YOU using? Post by: on June 11, 2004, 02:53:18 pm Post by: Draco on June 19, 2004, 01:52:18 pm Post by: Autumn Fire on June 19, 2004, 06:55:23 pm Post by: Cynic on June 20, 2004, 12:35:24 am This poll seems a little off, though. I went to a fur meet around here like a week ago, and out of the 30+ of us that showed up, I was one of the 3 guys that were straight. Haha, not quite what I was expecting, but I can definitely see how with all of the stereotypes, the straight furs would be nervous (I know I sure as hell was ) to hang out in public. *shrugs*Post by: Soulsky on June 21, 2004, 12:08:46 am So I guess I'm technically bisexual even though I feel straight. I have a feeling most people think I'm gay, though. More laments of a hopeless romantic, I guess. Post by: on June 21, 2004, 05:33:46 pm I still be your friend no matter what
Post by: on June 21, 2004, 05:35:52 pm I still be your friend no matter what
Post by: on June 21, 2004, 08:05:34 pm *shrugs* Maybe you act metrosexual, then (I think that's the word I'm loking for) It's not a bad thing, really...Hell, if you're straight it can be a good thing, cause for some reason the only gay guy who's really open in my school has like all female freinds
Post by: Humbajoe on June 22, 2004, 02:21:16 am (not that I mind. I have no problem with people of the gay sexuality. It just makes it difficult to look for possible girlfriends...)
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 22, 2004, 10:51:56 am
*Pats Humbajoe on the back* You've run into one of the unfortunate problems of the lovelorn straight fur. The fandom is approximately 80% male. My mate (female) mentioned how great the attention was and that she could basically pick who she wanted to be with at furry conventions because of the lack of female competition. However they do exist, so keep your hopes alive. Perhaps you can meet an open minded girl and bring her over to the fandom. Post by: Humbajoe on June 22, 2004, 11:37:31 am
Yeah, that may be one of my best bets. I also have this darn-fangled creation called "the Internet" to help me out as well. I have several close friends that have met the loves of their lives online, so I suppose it's not un-heard of lol. Post by: Zarathus on June 23, 2004, 09:16:17 pm
Yeah, I was kinda surprised when I saw that, too. And yeah... I dont mind about peoples sexuality either. It just makes it kinda...hard, like you said... And as for the internet...yeah. I know some people who have had online relationships which turned out to be good. I have had a couple of online relationships... which turned out to be terrible...but yeah. In some ways I guess online relationships are a lot harder than ones which start in real life... Post by: tairis_teigyr on June 24, 2004, 03:38:27 am Post by: on June 25, 2004, 12:56:47 pm Add the number of gay and bisexual together...it's more even. Yes, we females do exist. Most of us are either not interested in a relationship period, too young, or already taken, though
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 25, 2004, 01:18:19 pm
I agree with you completely on this. Online relationships are much harder to maintain than ones in RL. Usually the relationship means much more to one person than the other and the majority of them seem to end up with one person in the relationship getting hurt. Online relationships are often limited to text messages, which unfortunately is not the best way to develop an intimate relationship. In RL, touch plays a strong role in building an intimate bond between two people. It's possible to form emotional bonds with just text, however they usually aren't as strong as ones formed in RL, where touch plays a role as well. Post by: TigerWiccan on June 25, 2004, 02:37:33 pm
Post by: Soulsky on June 25, 2004, 03:38:03 pm I live in Alaska, and isolated as it tends to be, the internet is really the only way to find anyone. Especially in small towns where you can get to know everyone within just a few years... It seems really hopeless from time to time, but there are nice people around here regardless. I like to believe in fate... otherwise I'm a fair bit of screwed. XD If I had a choice... I'd be looking for a local relationship. But the chances are a lot lower up here. Ahh well. I'm not complaining. Post by: Zarathus on June 25, 2004, 05:24:20 pm
Yeah... just seeing text from one another, and then maybe talking on the phone really isnt...the same as real life. Some people who might feel that they love each other online, might end up not even liking each other, once they met in real life. And about it meaning more to one person than the other...that also seems true in most cases. For me, having someone completely obsessed with you, basing their whole life around you, and not listening to a word you say, isnt the most fun in the world. I can definitely say I did not feel the same for the guy... Online also seems a lot easier to...lie and stuff with, too. You could easily tell a person they are "the only one" and have 39750957 other people at the same time. Just like what happened to me once... >.o But anyway... Post by: Zarathus on June 25, 2004, 05:42:04 pm
Although where I live in new zealand is not...isolated or anything, it seems the only way to find anyone would be through the internet...for me, anyway. Yeah...there are also some nice people around where I am... but I am far too scared to ever say anything to them. Offline I am terrible with talking, unless I know the person well... and even then sometimes it can be hard. And...yeah. I think anyone would rather have a local relationship, where they could see the person more often. Post by: Bear Paw on June 25, 2004, 07:48:56 pm Post by: on July 01, 2004, 06:06:45 pm
Post by: SetzerGambbini on July 01, 2004, 06:15:25 pm Post by: Kris Fox on August 01, 2004, 08:24:45 pm I'm open minded and ocasionally RP a dif sex or play Bi or Gay. And yes I RP in more adult places. I have no interest in other guys or having a sex change. I am definatly Stright. Post by: Sorrow-from-Heart on August 03, 2004, 09:44:45 am If they just could stop wanting to look at my hair and stop trying to make pigtails in my hair then I would be all right (I have a very well taken care of long hair, so they love it.) I'm straight, but around 890 members can't decide what 100,000 people are. Post by: Benjamin on August 03, 2004, 01:11:27 pm Benjamin Post by: cloud on August 03, 2004, 04:42:48 pm
Post by: Nohbdy_121 on August 04, 2004, 05:12:49 pm I dont think I could ever have / maintain a same gender relationship. IMHO, it would be hard enough for me to get a lasting hetro relationship. Post by: Savaaha on August 04, 2004, 06:28:49 pm Post by: -Otakon- on August 04, 2004, 07:07:27 pm
Post by: deathspawn07 on August 06, 2004, 07:56:14 pm but if someone wants to be (quote from sling blade) "funny queer, not funny haha" that is completely thier choice Post by: Adamina on August 06, 2004, 08:07:14 pm
I think, saying that this poll was originally meant to see strait vs. gay vs. bi in furries, that someone would have to go and pick out the true furs. Not to offend anyone, but I'm quite sure that not everyone who voted in this poll is really a fur. Just passerbys checking out the scenery along the way... ~Ada Post by: Pillowmint on August 06, 2004, 08:22:31 pm
Unfortunately, Adamina, some true furs could still hurt the accuracy of this poll. For example, I voted as straight, since back in September I was still very much in the closet, and trying to fool myself and everyone else into thinking I was straight. So yeah, furs like me sill screw up the poll I guess one could take it as a sign of how all the accepting furs on furtopia made me feel better about accepting myself for being gay
Post by: Otto Lupo on August 06, 2004, 08:26:51 pm As was said before, we're just more open about things. It's not that big a deal. Love is more important then gender. Post by: Otto Lupo on August 06, 2004, 08:28:41 pm
Same here, except I wasn't around then to vote, so I got to vote honestly. Post by: Roxacat on August 09, 2004, 04:26:17 am
Post by: on August 10, 2004, 09:33:41 pm Post by: Autumn Fire on August 11, 2004, 02:57:18 am I have a few gay friends and sometimes I'd rather be around them then the jealous antics of girls. ^_^But I do get swamped from guys for online relationships, but I don't really like the idea of one though. I'm a very intimate person, and not being able to see the face of my bf, or feel his touch would drive me mad. And I have had a few bad incidents with meeting online guys.
Post by: on August 18, 2004, 11:33:50 pm
Post by: Kabaka on August 19, 2004, 05:30:24 am I hear that most furries are gay all the time. This poll is quite interesting to watch after hearing that. Mreh, either way, none of it bugs me. Post by: Kajidoh on August 26, 2004, 03:39:04 am Post by: on August 26, 2004, 12:48:00 pm
Post by: TigerWiccan on August 26, 2004, 03:13:40 pm Edit: Yay! 200 posts! Post by: Kajidoh on August 26, 2004, 03:23:01 pm Post by: Silvermane on August 31, 2004, 03:09:25 am Post by: Silvermane on August 31, 2004, 03:38:03 am Post by: Abe on September 06, 2004, 08:16:42 pm Yet to be in a relationship with either gender. Post by: Otto Lupo on September 06, 2004, 11:19:04 pm
hahaha. Yea, I'm not really femmy at all. Never really "act" gay.
Post by: Tawn-Cherie on September 07, 2004, 09:25:19 pm Post by: Otto Lupo on September 13, 2004, 08:51:38 pm Post by: Abe on September 13, 2004, 09:22:13 pm
Hopefully, I'll reach this point sometime soon. Post by: Rye on September 13, 2004, 11:46:07 pm Plus, I really do want to pounce all those hot punk chicks. As far as men go, I'v only ever wanted one night stands. *sigh. Post by: tara_fireofheart on September 14, 2004, 12:28:32 am I serious! Post by: Tommy Fox Stone on September 15, 2004, 02:43:24 am
Hmmm, Grins mischievously, I'm strarght, but I like a little kinky fun from time too time... Post by: ClockworkHare on September 15, 2004, 11:32:44 am
Post by: The Narrator on September 15, 2004, 08:09:57 pm Post by: Abe on September 15, 2004, 09:49:22 pm
So you're saying that since were furries, we're more comfortable with our sexualities so most of us tend to admit it if we really are gay? Still, quite a substantial amount of furries are gay; I wouldn't think that that much of the mundane world is homosexual as well. Just my thoughts though. Post by: AladTheAnthroMeerkat on September 15, 2004, 11:22:47 pm Post by: The Narrator on September 15, 2004, 11:29:31 pm
why are you sorry, it's perfectly fine. although i do find bi people incredibly greedy and indisisive. i mean for god sakes Pick a hole, everyone else has Post by: Kasarn on September 15, 2004, 11:35:41 pm
I've always thought that it, furries are much more open-minded about stuff in general (since furry is pretty much an artistic fandom which values creativity), as such, we are more ready to accept a person for being gay. Which, of course, results in more gay stuff being available in the furry community. Which then causes other people to question whether they are straight or not. I know, for myself, that I occasionally question whether I'm straight, but in the end, I have noted that it is a fairly conscious act on my half to be attracted towards another male (ie I have to think about it for at least a quarter of a second), whereas it is an unconscious act for me to be attracted towards a female (ie I can just stare at one without even realising it). And has anyone else noticed the bump in votes for bisexual? Back a hundred votes ago, gay and bi were about equal. Post by: Otto Lupo on September 15, 2004, 11:40:28 pm
Kind of heartless to treat a child that way. Hopefully your friend and his farther are able to reconcile someday. Society can be harsh, but some gay priders can get overzealous, which can cause some people to react negatively. ananimity helps a lot, but furs also tend to be more open-minded and supportive, making all types of people feel comfortable. That's a large part of what draws me to the furry community, and helped me accept that I'm gay.That last part's just hilarious. I had a dog that would hump almost anyone or anything. Do gay animals really exist? Or is that just a human thing? Post by: Abe on September 16, 2004, 02:41:41 am Don't quote me on this though. Post by: Taren on September 16, 2004, 09:27:36 am
I think that over 15% of geraffes are gay. Seriously. Their are gay animals, prooving that it has something to do with our brains, not because "we want to". Post by: Lascivus_Lutra on September 16, 2004, 03:09:19 pm Post by: Abe on September 16, 2004, 03:26:46 pm
I hate it when people think like this. If I honestly had a choice, I'd go striaght in a second. Makes things a lot easier. Unfortunately, I was brought up being told that being a homosexual was wrong and because of it it took me forever to figure out I was gay myself. Post by: Lascivus_Lutra on September 16, 2004, 03:28:03 pm Post by: The Narrator on September 16, 2004, 03:33:23 pm Post by: Akira on September 22, 2004, 11:55:50 pm Post by: Yip on September 27, 2004, 07:31:56 pm
Yes, I know how that is. Growing up, it seemed to me like it was something that was so wrong you're not even suppose to talk about it. For me, I didn't figure out I was gay until after I came to Furtopia (some time last year, and I'm only now getting to where I can be more open about it). I think the worst part was in being taught that the Bible is against it. (which I now believe to be false.) It's bad enough that society seems to say it's wrong, but then there's the whole idea that you can't be a Christian if you're gay. And another thing that clouded the issue is the stereotype that gays have, which I knew I didn't match and somehow took that to show that I wasn't gay. Now though, I don't understand how I let myself do that since I've always hated stereotyping anyways. I was also not a very social person growing up. Heck, I'm still not that social. I've gotten a lot better at it though. It was probably a combination of those factors that made it take so long for me. Post by: Otto Lupo on September 27, 2004, 07:45:09 pm Being socially inept and not know anything outside of the stereotypes kept me away from people besides a couple girls, untill I realized it was a load and I could be my own person and finally figuered things out Post by: on September 27, 2004, 11:50:15 pm
Post by: Maltarius on September 28, 2004, 02:30:09 am Post by: Abe on September 28, 2004, 09:13:49 am
Hang in there, Mal. A lot of us had and currently have had to go through the same thing. It'll get better, it just takes time. Once you moveout (whenever that may be), just do what feels right to you.
Post by: Leo on October 03, 2004, 10:11:07 pm
Oh no no, I assure you its not false, I could find you the lines where its stated, but I realy dont want anyone to hate me for doing so. In all honesty though, everyone is bisexual, everyone makes the choice to be gay or straight. It is a choice for the individual themself to make. It is not anyone elses right to decide wether it is good or bad. It is everyones right to decide wether or not knowing someone this way bothers them or not. That doesnt give them the right to do little more then maybe tell the other person they feal it is a bad choice. (and this should be done with respect as well of course) I personally shall never support homosexuality, or bisexuality. But I will support ones persuit for true happiness. It would be wrong of me to hold anything against anyone, no matter what they are. Its all about who you are I guess. *scratches head* everytime I reply to a topic like this it starts to make more and more sence to me, I just hope no one gets upset with me for this. Post by: InertiAWolF on October 03, 2004, 10:22:28 pm Post by: Yip on October 04, 2004, 03:16:37 am
I too could point out “the lines where its stated” for I have spent a great deal of time studying this. The problem is, you have to take those lines with the surrounding context. When people use them against homosexuality, they always take them out of context. And then they state stuff like “the bible clearly says...” when it is not that clear on the issue. From what I can tell, it doesn't really have much to say on the subject, but at the very least it's not as strongly against it as people seem to say. If you want, you can PM me and we could telk more about it. Post by: GothicFox on October 04, 2004, 06:10:41 am I have a mate now. He's another fur from here in NZ (a ferret if you're wondering), and we met up IRL for a sci-fi/comic book con about a week ago. I was surprised, excited and overjoyed that out online relationship was just as compatible offline. We shared an amazing week together. I've never been that close to anyone before, let alone another guy. But after a bit of time our genders didn't seem to matter, I know it might sound cheesy but all that mattered was my love for him. I still feel this way about him. We live a long way from each other and we've both agreed that long-distance relationships can be tough, so I don't know what our future will hold really. So now I don't know what to call myself. I know that now I definately prefer guys but I'm having a really hard time coming to grips with it. I have a lot of furiends who are gay and they seem really happy but, I don't know. I think for the moment I'm still bi, but I definately feel myself sliding across. I really don't know where I can turn to talk about this; my parents don't know and I don't want them to, only two of my friends know but they don't want to talk about it. So yeh, fair to say I'm very confused right now. Sorry for rambling but I'm kind of in a very rare open mood. I just don't know anymore. Post by: Bear Paw on October 10, 2004, 09:15:03 pm . Lastly let those who need to know know about your partner. Eventualy there may come a time when your parents will need to know but YOU can choose when and where that happens { break it to em gently} . Other than me and Ursan wish you both the best and hope you work out your feelings .
Post by: crash-clash on October 18, 2004, 04:41:34 pm i can't remember what i posted before, but i feel that just by being furry, one is an open person, and open isn't just limited to, but does include sexuality. most people do have some feelings for the opposite sex, but its just been drilled into them that liking another guy or another girl is wrong, so they deny the feeling. i'll bet most furries are bi, but those that are gay are just gay, and those that are straight are just straight. that part of life doesn't have much to do with furry. on an interesting side note... i'm bi too! woo! Post by: bushidofox on October 19, 2004, 11:35:59 pm Post by: Jadoc on October 19, 2004, 07:21:04 pm Post by: Midnight Fury on October 19, 2004, 08:12:31 pm Post by: Hat-Kun on October 21, 2004, 03:14:48 am *Goes off on a stabbity-stab-stab rampage with a muffin against all those who violate the unspoken word that all furries must be bi or gay* *Comes back and dusts off his labcoat* *Ahem* Pardon me there. I just needed to sort those strange people out. Straight indeed, how dare they? Post by: Brackhar on October 21, 2004, 03:30:22 am -Brackhar Post by: Klaerth Juraviel on October 21, 2004, 07:42:33 am
Post by: T Fox on October 21, 2004, 09:17:41 am *Runs from the deranged kangaroo* Post by: Hat-Kun on October 21, 2004, 12:37:03 pm Stab! Stab! Stab! Stab! Stab! Muffin! Post by: Xylia Varvara on October 21, 2004, 02:55:00 pm Post by: Hat-Kun on October 22, 2004, 01:46:09 pm As for the rest of you, perhaps the Super-Cute Gay Bar will do something for you. Post by: Lobar on November 06, 2004, 10:59:54 am ...Bi.
Post by: Hat-Kun on November 06, 2004, 09:28:02 pm Post by: CarLOS on November 17, 2004, 02:18:29 am
ROFLMAO! Straight here too However, I do have a strong, supporting admiration for the gay community, since I have many gay friends. I also live in the province that pioneered the legality same-sex unions
Post by: cloud on November 17, 2004, 07:22:44 am
Im not straight (gay) :P Post by: MorbidCorvid on November 19, 2004, 09:19:22 am Post by: CarLOS on November 19, 2004, 12:34:41 pm
Well, then there's yet ANOTHER category - Straight (but curious)
Post by: Kasarn on December 03, 2004, 08:00:19 pm I'm nut sure if this deserves a bump or whether we should just start a new one so people who've changed their mind can adjust their vote and can add some "inbetween" categories. But I figure, it's been going for this long so this thread can't fade into obscurity halfway down page 2
Post by: Mazz on December 03, 2004, 09:08:22 pm I guess what I am would be pansexual. mainly i dont descriminate on the persons sex. Post by: Enumclaw on December 04, 2004, 10:20:34 pm Post by: WildbillTX on December 05, 2004, 11:45:30 am Post by: Mazz on December 16, 2004, 11:04:11 am
Mazz like your icon. your not a poser. my sexuality isnt up there. i'm still sad about that. eh oh well mabey i'll make one with it since i responded again i guess i'llput Pansexual again ~Mazz Post by: on December 16, 2004, 04:02:54 pm wikipedia Sociology Post by: Burr on December 16, 2004, 04:35:59 pm Post by: Miakoda on December 16, 2004, 05:48:16 pm I think I'll still hold back from letting one of my friends whose Mormon in on it though... not bashing the Mormon faith or anything... but its hard for her to accept things she doesn't understand/has been taught is wrong. I think the rest of my friends will be pretty accepting, though, and if not, well... me finally making this somewhat known will at least open up a whole new group of people for me to associate with. Wee. >:} And for those who are wondering... I guess you could call my religious faith Eclecticism? I derive my beliefs from all different religions, with a center in Christianity, but I view the Bible more as poetry, and open to many different interpretations. Post by: Quamer on December 27, 2004, 08:05:52 pm Post by: Dixie Landoe on January 02, 2005, 07:06:38 pm although, I have nothing against gays or bis. doesn't really matter one way or the other to me.
Post by: Karazynn on January 02, 2005, 09:41:46 pm Post by: Maelstrom on January 04, 2005, 04:24:09 pm Thing is, I just recently came out, but, I had been in denial about it since, oh... back when I was in 7th or 8th grade. (Freshman in college now). I also hope one day to have a significant other in my life. Of course, I live smack dab in the Bible belt, so... it's kind of hard to tell my friends and such that I'm gay. Of course, a very close friend of mine (one which happens to be a conservative and heavy church goer) found out about me being gay, and doesn't care. I'm just glad I've got an overly liberal family, so I have someone to talk to 'bout being gay. Post by: Psycho Fox R on January 08, 2005, 01:44:38 am Post by: Burr on January 08, 2005, 10:27:17 am I'm still pretty closeted about the whole thing. I see no reason for my friends to know and I'll be out of college and away from them soon, so I'd rather keep quiet about it til I'm out of there. Then maybe I'll be a little more open. I know I plan on telling my parents eventually. Post by: on January 16, 2005, 07:52:49 am we are nice people! Post by: Ag. on January 16, 2005, 09:56:12 am Post by: RavenWolf on January 17, 2005, 02:07:46 am
I'm straight to and I thought the same thing. judging by this poll and just talking to furs I found that 50% are completely straight and the other half was gay/bi/whatever. But when I went to my first furmeet all 20 furs that showed up were all gay. Is it that most straight furs don't go to meets or what? Post by: Lost_Cause on January 20, 2005, 06:20:36 pm Even though I've only every tried any kind of a close relationship with 1 woman who came out as a lesbian (not because of me) and the left the country (I'm really not that bad) not long after I’m going for the safe choice of Bi Post by: Kyuzo on January 26, 2005, 03:32:36 am Post by: on January 26, 2005, 03:52:47 am Or, so I think. Post by: Ag. on January 26, 2005, 03:04:31 pm Post by: on January 26, 2005, 03:42:08 pm
this is false as with all lifeforms humans have a natural and uninhibitable (if thats a word) desire to procreate as such you DO want to have sex even if only subconsiously. so whether or not you choose to be "asexual" you actualy arent now where same sex attraction and homosexuality comes in yes its a thing possibly caused by upbringing or as lots of gays like to think it could be genetic. more probably in my opinion anyway it could be a mixture of both in the way that it could be a nature derrived mechanism to reduce massive populations ah well dosent matter really as im talking crap at this point. well have some free nonsense Post by: Ritsuki on January 26, 2005, 03:43:45 pm Oh and I'm straight. Post by: Twilight on February 03, 2005, 02:19:55 am
Post by: Scani on February 03, 2005, 11:16:46 am -- Scani Lupena Post by: KirinKat on March 03, 2005, 05:06:45 am Post by: on March 03, 2005, 02:03:11 pm Welcome to Furtopia!
Post by: Sheeta on March 03, 2005, 08:36:42 pm I'm straight. I's luvs me da beef sausage! Post by: Mariella on March 04, 2005, 12:18:09 am Truthfully, since i am bisexual, i was more open to trying other things that aren't mainstream. So maybe the lifestyle makes it easier for sexual furries to be furries. Fans of art, and fans of the creature, they could be either way? Post by: Agent_Blayze on March 04, 2005, 12:41:07 am I come from the standpoint of generally disliking anything that is overly popular, and it appears that gay/bi-ness is certainly gaining. Not that that is necessarily bad, it's just, ya gotta wonder now if they really are or if they're just forcing themselves to be (I know too many people like that ='...'=) Post by: Nate Dogg on March 14, 2005, 05:57:04 am Post by: Flashy on March 15, 2005, 10:46:27 pm Post by: Tip T. Fox on March 17, 2005, 10:15:10 am Besides, who needs a fox when you can have a VIXEN! Bonus! So yah, I'm straight. Post by: Burr on March 17, 2005, 11:21:22 am
Post by: Spike on March 17, 2005, 11:25:24 am Post by: Tip T. Fox on March 17, 2005, 02:20:49 pm Post by: Burr on March 17, 2005, 03:44:08 pm
I'm just kidding, though. Post by: Tip T. Fox on March 17, 2005, 04:04:59 pm
Post by: Candlelight on March 25, 2005, 08:18:43 pm I like my stallions.
Post by: Dark Maiden on March 30, 2005, 08:21:16 am
Post by: Heat on March 30, 2005, 09:08:08 pm Post by: Hat-Kun on March 31, 2005, 02:42:26 pm Beugheugh.
Post by: Ferret Gamer Kei on April 09, 2005, 04:51:47 pm Post by: Shurakai on April 10, 2005, 07:29:04 am Post by: Burr on April 12, 2005, 09:11:19 am
Tell him to brush his teeth and use mouthwash first next time.
Post by: Tip T. Fox on April 12, 2005, 10:32:50 am No, really. Post by: Cashuea on April 12, 2005, 11:04:44 am heh, this poll surprized me though, alll the other furrys ive meet were either Bi or gay/lesbian. till i red this i thought i was one of hte few remaining stright furrys.
Post by: Burr on April 12, 2005, 11:30:41 am Post by: Ferret Gamer Kei on April 12, 2005, 12:48:57 pm I'm not bothering asking people to brush their teeth. That's their own biz. *nodnod* As for me, I've got eyes open on some womenly women. OO;;; Or some tomboyish women OO;; Or just plain women... I'm available >>; Post by: CarLOS on April 13, 2005, 12:49:53 am
I think you're right. We're the only balanced ones. This place is just "Home Sweet Home"
Post by: Tigress on May 15, 2005, 09:34:54 am Post by: GunSlinger on May 15, 2005, 11:12:35 pm
Post by: Tech Wolfox on May 16, 2005, 08:17:44 am Well, seen i've voted I better add my 2c to the conversation. I'm really confused with my sexuality at the moment so I went with the 'fence sitter' option - bi. Three months ago I would have voted straight without really thinking about what I truly felt inside. Recently though I have been putting some thought into my sexuality and came to the conclusion that I was bi. It doesn't seem to be stopping there though. Now I'm coming to the realisation that I could quite possibly be gay. Like Rikimaru said back in March last year "...i started out bi and just kinda slid to the other side of the fence...". I'm feeling like that now. I have been slightly homophobic in the past so it is a real shock to me that I am interested in males. Up until now I haven't really been interested in either gender and I used to think that because I was a 'late bloomer' that my interest in women would grow. Doesn't seem like that is going to be the case. It has all happened pretty fast so I am not coming out just yet. You want to be pretty positive about something like that so I am waiting & seeing how things pan out just in case I start heading back the other way (unlikely I know). Even though I am yet to be in a relationship (male or female) I echo what Chaz and many others in this topic have said, "...as long as you love the person/furson you are with, what sex or furry animal they are doesn't matter. does it?" TW Edit: Thought I might add my Kinsey score - today it's 4. Tomorrow - who knows Post by: Kayf on May 19, 2005, 10:15:14 am Post by: Yip on May 27, 2005, 03:49:25 pm At the time people were talking about where they fall on the Kinsey scale, and I purposely didn't answer that way. Because the only answer that I would have excepted of myself was zero. But yet even through my self deception, I knew there was no way I was a zero. Though at that time, I wouldn't have ever thought that I was a 4 or 5 (probably closer to 5) I think that's because I fought it so much. I mean, I've known for what seems like forever that I had “sexual issues”. I never really understood it, but I also would not allow myself to explore my sexuality out of fear of falling deep into the pits of sin or something like that. In the end, I think all I really accomplished was making myself feel terrible about it. Because as hard as I'd try, as much as I tried to place faith in the Lord that he would save me from it, I would still end up having fantasies... It was getting to the point that I was starting to feel like I just wasn't good enough for God. At one point, I even seriously considered castrating myself. I decided against it because I wasn't convinced it'd make the fantasies go away, and because I was afraid I might not be able to keep that a secret. And I really didn't want to explain why I'd do something like that. (the pain involved was also a consideration, but not one of the main ones.) Now however, I'm very glad that I didn't do anything that extreme. Post by: Melina on May 31, 2005, 06:10:14 pm Post by: Mock on June 01, 2005, 03:11:44 am Yay for the Straight ppls! Post by: ssshipwrek on June 03, 2005, 06:53:57 pm Post by: fox-a-lex on June 04, 2005, 03:41:31 am I have certainly been confused, and initially the realization was really tearing me asunder. At least now I am not as stressed about it. It is very apparent to me that I am bi. I know that for sure now. So, that is what I voted. If I were straight, the whole idea of two males, or any RL situation that comes close, should bother me in a bad way. But it doesn't. In fact, it's the opposite. As far as that goes, very male persons (and furry art) are not attractive to me at all. They have to be slightly soft and effeminite at least in appearance, a gentle-man like me, I guess. But not feminine in the way they think or act. When that is the case, I find it very attractive. The fact that I'm Bi was a big surprise to me, but maybe I shouldn't feel so surprised. If you look around my place, it doesn't look like that of a solidly straight person. Neither does the car I drive, nor the clothes I wear. I've always had a kind of eccentricity of taste, especially towards things that are ornate. You could probably call it effeminite, but it isn't feminine. I don't like flowers or the type of decor females would prefer. My style is like Chairman Kaga on Iron Chef, or that of King Ludwig II of Bavaria (obscure, but maybe people know who that is). I've also been asked on more than one occasion by aquaintences if I was gay. For every one person who asked, there are probably several that couldn't bring themselves to ask. So, that must say something about the appearance I put out. I also have absolutely no interest in watching or knowing anything about sports. Playing a sport isn't so bad, but getting into the whole sports thing has never appealed to me whatsoever. And what is more manly than talking sports? Then again, I once took a psychological test to rate how male/female your thinking is, and I rated 95% male, way above what most men score. So... who knows what that means. I also never felt a huge desire to go after women either, not in that predatory way I probably should. When I was in high-school, going after girls just wasn't high on my priorities; I would rather do other things. The same was true in college. Unfortunately, being the self-doubter that I am, sometimes I wonder if it is a chicken and an egg thing. Do I feel like I can't relate to women because I never made a huge effort, or did I never make a huge effort because that's naturally how I am? To this day though, with most females I meet, after I talk to them for a few minutes, I would rather go do something else. I just feel like we have nothing to relate about. Along those lines, unlike some of the people's comments here, I don't identify with females at all. Many people of a gay/bi persuasion have said they have more female friends or can better relate to them, but that definitely isn't my case. Females as friends doesn't make sense to me. It certainly isn't black and white, I can say that much. Just the other night, I was at the local sushi bar and a girl sat next to me, and started talking to me. I did find her physically attractive, which with females doesn't happen to me all that often. So, physically, females can be attractive, but I don't think I could ever love them, especially since love is really like the highest order of friendship. I've been with females sexually, I've been seduced by them, but I never felt any love behind it. And to me love is the most important thing by far. I don't even mean 'eternal love', just love at that moment, which I never felt. I do feel like love is the most important thing, and I guess that means gender comes second. And love between two males seems really palpable to me. So, I guess on a scale right now, I would be near the center, but the whole question of love pushes me towards the male end. (And yeah, it has all happened pretty fast. It reminds me of the thread about SWIII, where people were discussing how fast Anakin turned to the other side. Not that one side or the other is the "dark side", that's not what I mean at all. Just that I feel a similarity to the ambivalence, speed, and troubling process of his transformation.) Edit: It's kind of funny. I just remembered that 2 to 3 years ago, regarding my inability to find any females I was interested in, I used to joke with my friends that I needed to just find a nice lesbian and settle down. Close, but not quite ;-) Post by: Shadow-Da-Wolf on June 04, 2005, 04:41:23 am Post by: on June 08, 2005, 03:38:47 pm I think I got bored of girls, or something.... I'll be sure to keep you updated in case anything changes
Post by: Drake Blackpaw on June 08, 2005, 04:39:12 pm
*Smiles and shakes his head* I don't think I could ever get bored of girls. There just so nicely different than boys. Not saying that boys couldn't be fun, but if the menu has girls and boys on it, I'd likely to always pick girls. Post by: Fizer on June 08, 2005, 07:36:37 pm Post by: Aerisyka on June 08, 2005, 10:17:45 pm Anyway. I'm about as straight as a Pikachu's tail. (Sorry- can't- resist- the in-joke~) Yeah. When I was little I never worried much about it, I'm not one of those little kids that dreams of growing up and getting married to Prince Charming or something. Better things to worry about... >_< When I got a little older, around 5th-6th grade or so, I just kinda assumed I was straight. Still never paid much attention to it. Around the end of 6th, going into 7th, I kind of started to think I might not be. Of course I was in a bit of supressed denial, only because everybody was always so, "Ew! Gay!!" and stuff like that. I kinda liked this one guy for a month or two, but not really. For a while I thought I was bi. Then somewhere between 8th grade and now I was just like, yeah, I like girls. Men just don't do anything for me. Actually, I think they're kind of icky. Well, I mean that as in anything more than friends. I have lots of friends who are guys. But jonestly, it just kind of grosses me out to think of myself in a rekationship with some guy. As for openness? Only my furry family knows. It's not something I'd want to be too open about right now. My mom and I had an awkward discussion about it once, and she's still in heavy denial. She tries hard to be accepting, but you can tell when the subject comes up she's totally uncomfortable with it. As for my human friends, I'm not about to tell them outright anytime soon, but I think the inadvertantly-thrown-in-subtext is more than enough of a hint. If someone calls me gay as a freindly insult (we joke like that) I don't deny it. I stopped using the word gay as an insult a long time ago. It's popular slang around here. I won't deny it, but I won't flaunt it. I'm happy with who I am. Post by: on June 08, 2005, 10:42:29 pm
Meh, been there, done that :P Tee-heeeeeee Post by: Koneko on June 09, 2005, 02:25:01 am
Good! More for me! All teh boiz are mine hehehe! Post by: cloud on June 09, 2005, 05:46:39 am
we'll see about that! gwahahaha *lures one into a bag using cake and steals it* Post by: Koneko on June 09, 2005, 06:49:29 pm 
Post by: Aerisyka on June 09, 2005, 06:53:02 pm Fine with me, you can have 'em! Post by: cloud on June 10, 2005, 06:22:03 am
:S doesnt work Post by: spikethegoddess on June 13, 2005, 02:19:58 pm Post by: CarLOS on June 13, 2005, 06:21:22 pm
Error 69 The sexually related answer you gave was clear as mud ---- Dirty Mind 1.0 server at CarLOS.org
Post by: Tag on June 15, 2005, 02:31:48 am Post by: Furball on June 28, 2005, 03:21:40 am
Post by: on June 28, 2005, 04:09:39 am Should it matter, I am bi. Yes, I'm pretty sure everyone in my life knows. No, they don't care. Post by: RebelKat on June 28, 2005, 09:10:04 am
I think it's more a security thing than a Gay thing... *looks at his growing collection of plushies* Sometimes when I really miss someone, I'll sleep with a plushie that someone gave me... It really does make me feel better, like theres a kind of connection there... *snuggles his Good Luck Bear* Post by: Sleet on June 28, 2005, 10:18:02 am I'd say I agree with a lot of what TechWolf and Fox-a-lex have to say. So, for fear of repitition, I'll just end my discussion there Add another bi to the ranks! ^_^ Post by: Tech Wolfox on June 28, 2005, 11:10:30 am Well I slid to the other side of the fence... Technically I still class myself as Bi (75%/25%) but to 'normal' people I just say I'm gay. Yep another gay furry. Suprised? LOL I'm now seeing a fur (Shy-Cry Wolf) that I met in Furtopia chat and things are going really well so I couldn't be happier. (Wonders what Sleetfawx & fox-a-lex's take will be on this.) TW (Kinsey score = 5) Post by: Sleet on June 28, 2005, 11:53:03 am
Post by: fox-a-lex on June 29, 2005, 06:40:45 am
If that's the criterion you're using, then I'd have to say I'm in the same boat. I don't know if I could break it out into some sort of split percentage though, because relating to a female or a male is each a whole different thing on so many levels, or so it seems to me. As far as what I would say to normal people, it would be Bi, because I don't think saying I'm gay is completely accurate. Preferably though, to normal people I would say nothing. That is because 1) I don't see much advantage in telling others and 2) the issue is very personal to me and I have no desire to mention it or discuss it with normal people. So, my take on it? Well, I'm very happy you found someone. I actually found someone recently myself... and now I'm deep into uncharted territory... But it is good finding someone. That answers a lot of questions real quick. Post by: ][GEMINI][ on June 29, 2005, 07:49:49 am
Post by: Tech Wolfox on June 29, 2005, 09:28:05 am
Boy it sure does!!! LOL I've discovered more about myself in the last six weeks that I have in the last ten years and I've finally found the real me. Good to hear you've met someone too. TW Post by: fox-a-lex on June 29, 2005, 07:38:05 pm
Hahahaha... you Brits are too funny! "And YOU! Cake or death!?" "Ummm.... cake please." Post by: Darkness Falls on June 30, 2005, 05:01:33 pm I suppose I'd better throw my two cents in here. I don't talk about my sexuality much (I'm British, we're supposed to be repressed ), but you guys and gals are all fairly open about it so I don't see why I shouldn't be. I'm not a very heavily sexual person, and I sort of fell into the 'straight' camp by default. I've been in love a couple of times with girls when I was younger, but I've recently discovered I've developed feelings for another guy. It really surprised me at first, but there it is, and I can't very well pretend I haven't, so I guess I'm more bi than I thought. Although I only tend to be attracted to people I know well, I don't tend to see people and instantly fall in love with them the way I know it works with some people.Soooo.... yah. *blushes and slinks out of the thread* D.F. Post by: Seelas on July 16, 2005, 12:58:23 am I grew up in Massachusetts, one of the most liberal states out there, so I never really had any problems with acceptance or coming out. At the same time though, I read about the push for anti-gay legislation every day in the news - sometimes it's frightening to think how little we've progressed! Post by: Arbutus on July 16, 2005, 01:43:05 am I'm nothing. I'm not straight, gay, or bi. I guess the closest thing to what I am is asexual, but I'm not really sure if I fit that definition... I mean, porn and yiff of pretty much any orientation turns me on because it's obviously meant to be erotic, but when it comes to IRL... *shrug* I have no interest in pursuing any of it IRL, really. I don't know, the whole thing confuses me enought that I'm kind of resistant to assign that term to myself and, you know, feel locked in by my choice. So I remain in my semi-content state of labellessness. If anyone asks, though, I default to straight. =:P Post by: DJ Wolfsin on July 16, 2005, 04:32:09 am I think i'd file in the Bi category although I wont admit it straight up... kind of a shy family thing. But I have been asked if I was a lesbian cause of the way I dress and act like a tomboy. (How that question is equal to my life style I have no clue) But I do like BOY to BOY action. And have gone out with boys in the past and even lost my purity to one. So... I'm 85% straight to 10% Bi and 5% Other. :):)
Post by: whitedingo on July 16, 2005, 04:44:23 am Post by: Chemical_Abyss on July 29, 2005, 10:31:15 pm
Yeh... try being gay in Tennessee... especially in a town as small as mine... it's horrid. Post by: Claudio on July 31, 2005, 08:43:38 pm
This is really how i go about it. I hate labels. Post by: AlastorKnight on August 01, 2005, 12:48:34 am
Post by: on August 01, 2005, 02:05:00 pm people tell me I am open like a book so why hold back now? I am bi, but my current mate is female and luffles her to death <3
Post by: tyrannis on August 01, 2005, 06:00:31 pm
Wow.... props to everyone one here for being so open about their sexuality, it's great to see that people don't have to be in the closet as far as furtopia is concerned now this is an interesting quote from gemini, because all though people might just label him as bi or gender confused, it might actually be more in-depth then that, as there are a few people who are not sexually aroused by men\gay porn, but they happen to fnd gay yiffy erotic. i personally don't know why this is, maybe some thoughts on the subject? I'm happy to say that i'm staight and i have nothing against homosexuals or bis. . There was a documentry about why some people are gay, and i thin it was something to do with an overdose of estegen (female hormone) when male teenagers are going through puberty. this also work in reverse for women during their teenage years. (an overdose of testosterone, male hormone) i don't really know though, i'm just sharing my thoughts. :P Food for thought: is it neccessarily your fault if you are gay/bi? on a side note, i don't think there is anything wrong with having gay friends if you are straight; friendships don't have to relationships. i have this friend in RL, who i think is a closet homo. he won't admit it, although he is "out" and does gay things\habits (one of which is this limp in his left hand/arm, lol), of which he dosen't deny sometimes, so everone pretty much knows he's gay lol. i don't mind but if goes "too far" i just tell him to cool it. no-one had any clue he might be gay untll about a year ago, when he started being "open". i just see him as the friend i knew 3 years ago, not some gay freak. homophobia is just plain wrong. keep it up guys, i would really like to know how this turns out. EDIT: i read somewhere once that the reason most furs are gay\bi is because most fursuiters at convententions have grup sex at some point so they don't really care about gender preference. now i don't believe this to be the only/main reason, and i would like to know why many furs are gay/bi. Post your thoughts here!!! Post by: Koneko on August 03, 2005, 02:22:32 pm
Yeah, I notice that alot among furries. Personally, I am gay (or at least bi with preferance for males, I'll take what I can get ), but I don't particularly like (most) gay "adult" movies.However, I love m/m yiffy pics. I find that in general erotica that is drawn rather than filmed is way more, well, erotic. For example, although girls don't usually turn me on much anymore, hentai still does it for me. Weird, huh?
Of course not
Post by: Finnish Fox on August 04, 2005, 12:10:09 am
1. I highly doubt that documentary is true. I have not heard anything that proves how people become gay/strait. I try to stay in tune with resent medical developments, and that would be a big one. 2. I doubt it's anyone’s fault if they are gay or bi or strait. like I said, I don't believe anyone has found out why people are gay or not. I know I didn't choose to be gay, it just sort of happened. I cant choose not to be gay, its not my fault, just as it is not my fault I was born in america or am blond. 3. I really don't know about that last thing. you'd have to ask someone whose fursuited at cons more than me, but when I would doubt it. that sound like something from CSI Post by: Yip on August 04, 2005, 12:17:09 am
How it turns out? How what turns out? Looking at how long this thread is, it doesn't seem to me like it'll be ending any time soon. So I'm not sure what you mean. Anyway...
I believe there is another thread that deals with that question more directly, (though it may also have been touched upon in this thread in the past.) The best theory I heard was that it's due to the fandom being more accepting to it. Anyways, I believe as the fandom becomes more widespread the numbers will change to more like what it is for the general population. (in other words, I don't believe there is a direct link between the two.) Post by: Max on August 28, 2005, 10:27:08 pm Post by: Silph on August 29, 2005, 04:41:40 am Everyone is bisexual, only religion and society stop us from realising this. *Glares at everyone who didn't vote 'Bisexual'* >_> Post by: Niafabo on August 31, 2005, 07:53:52 pm Post by: CarLOS on August 31, 2005, 08:00:25 pm
That is an interesting theory. Post by: Niafabo on August 31, 2005, 08:23:01 pm
i use to think that but after awhile i realized that some people honestly get turned off by the opposite sex no matter how hard they try to think of them sexually. it's called being in the closet. :S Post by: Malachi on September 05, 2005, 03:31:20 am I love the ladies but I've always been open to just love....lemme explain I would LIKE to fall in love with a Girl, but if I were to fall in love with a guy...well *shrugs shoulders* Whaddya gonna do right? So I guess that could be considered being bisexual...right? But since I have such a strong preference to girls I DO consider myself a lesbian. yet another rainbow fur!
Post by: Kiva on September 07, 2005, 07:15:54 pm Oh and on the thing about being gay in a small town you should try mine everyday i run for my life so yah they hate gays/bi's/les here. *looks around coutiously*Oh s*** gotta run the mob is back* runs out the back door of the library* Post by: Zanner on December 07, 2005, 06:56:22 pm Edit: 200th post, YAY Post by: Serra Belvoule on December 07, 2005, 07:01:45 pm Post by: Savaaha on December 07, 2005, 07:13:01 pm Post by: RedneckFur on December 07, 2005, 10:19:21 pm Besides, there is enough high quality yiffy art out there to bring out the 'curiosity' in anyone Savaaha, I think you will get your wish somtime within the next 20 years or so. From what I have seen of the younger generation now in its early teens, they are very open minded and accepting of others unique qualities. Post by: Streak on December 08, 2005, 01:11:06 am Post by: KiyoshiAkita on December 08, 2005, 03:27:17 am I wouldn't exactly consider myself gay, or straight, or bisexual. I'd say more along the lines of pan-sexual. I think time spent together goes beyond the borders of gender. It's about the person, not what is between their legs. I always knew I had some different feelings; I just tried to deny it to myself (mainly because I was afraid of being rejected by the world)...that is, until I grew up a bit and got my own mind - free from the influences of the biases of society - and lost sight of those silly little issues that some people tend to get so hung up on. There's not enough time to judge and dislike people for who they are naturally or what choices they make. I'd rather have fun with life.
Post by: Darkness Falls on December 08, 2005, 05:16:31 pm D.F. Post by: Sirrinose on December 09, 2005, 12:36:05 pm Post by: Yip on December 09, 2005, 12:46:21 pm
So would that be the same as 87.5% straight and 12.5% gay? Post by: Alex on December 09, 2005, 01:47:30 pm Post by: on December 09, 2005, 02:00:30 pm -Mik Genocide Post by: Black Foot on December 09, 2005, 02:35:26 pm Post by: Party Pony on December 09, 2005, 03:08:31 pm
Does that mean you like boy dogs and girl dogs? Post by: on December 10, 2005, 02:12:05 pm
yup. -Mik G-Nizzle Post by: Hol Tiger on December 10, 2005, 04:35:37 pm Post by: Streak on December 12, 2005, 12:13:16 am Post by: Zanner on February 16, 2006, 03:41:07 pm Post by: Streak on February 18, 2006, 04:35:00 am Post by: Sword Lemur on February 18, 2006, 09:24:42 am Post by: TripR on February 18, 2006, 01:22:15 pm
Post by: Frosty on February 21, 2006, 07:38:51 pm im strait btw. Post by: Taren on February 21, 2006, 07:46:10 pm
Post by: Keeshanic Fox on February 25, 2006, 03:07:03 am Post by: Kwan on February 25, 2006, 08:10:28 pm (Margaret Cho's Mom reference) Post by: Skulk7 on February 27, 2006, 06:00:36 pm Post by: Mr. FroFox on February 27, 2006, 09:35:43 pm
Lol! I can empathize, I proclaimed asexuality in 11th grade just so girls would stop bothering me about dating and the like... "Will you go out with me?" "No." "*exasperated* Why not?!" "Not really interested. Sorry." "Oh...wow, I had no idea you were gay...thats ok." *sigh* Yea. after the whole asexuality bit, girls would accept the fact that I was currently just interested in friendship. Groan. Is that really so bad?! Quick question, I forgot where the post was but I am wondering, what exactly is a "zoo"? Never heard of that orientation.
Post by: Streak on February 27, 2006, 11:36:50 pm Not to be confused with bestiality which is "A separate term, (more common in mainstream usage), refers to human/animal sexual activity" Quotes from Wikipedia.org. Post by: KiyoshiAkita on February 28, 2006, 12:04:39 am I've always known zoophilia to simply mean a love for animals. And then there is "zoo-ex," short for "zoo-exclusive," which is on the same subject but a whole different level - I'm guessing you all can figure that one out. (think, people who marry their animals) (Sorry if this is a bit too...racy...for the area) Post by: Firehazard on February 28, 2006, 12:47:34 am
Funny, I never had that problem myself.
Post by: Mr. FroFox on February 28, 2006, 06:30:01 am
Post by: Serra Belvoule on February 28, 2006, 11:21:06 am =n-n= of course, and "other" option's needed, I think. Post by: ClockworkHare on February 28, 2006, 02:15:10 pm Everyone knows we're just the asexual result of a horny monkey and the first animal cracker. Post by: Streak on February 28, 2006, 02:29:45 pm Post by: Etherian Blightbane on February 28, 2006, 02:35:25 pm Don't be a mindless machine.. Do it because you CHOSE IT! Don't judge others and hate others.. Is pointless to try to controll the willful.. As for those without their own will, We should teach them to have their own will and gide them.. I won't tell you how to live your life.. I won't tell you how you should live your life.. I will however try to make this place a better one.. How do we do this? This is what your mind automatically says.. We do this by helping eachother find their own path.. Will the world change? Maybe not.. The only way the world will be better is if we help eachother.. But first YOU must learn to help yourself before you can get help Life is too short to waste it.. Help yourself and those would need it.. I implore you to try this! If only the world understoud?.. no.. if only the world accepted, that is what needs to happen.. Post by: Taren on February 28, 2006, 02:40:08 pm
Suuuure... (; Post by: Mange on February 28, 2006, 04:34:42 pm Its not Bi-Sexual...its Bi-Sensual. Women are beautiful, attractive, and I love to look at them. But I'm also a chic and know how we can get sometimes...heh. Post by: Qubit on February 28, 2006, 06:05:21 pm Simply put: No physical attraction to people in real life. No mental attraction as of yet. At the moment I don't imagine myself ending up with a woman; I prefer the idea of being with a guy. Where yiff is concerned, I like males pretty exclusively at the moment. Post by: truefox on March 07, 2006, 09:34:24 pm though im not entirerly sure, my fursonas bi and i dont know what i am Post by: KiyoshiAkita on March 07, 2006, 10:28:03 pm I guess I could speak a bit... When asked if I am gay, I respond with a 'no.' I tell them that I ain't straight neither. Nor bi. I'm not really physically attracted to a man - nor woman for that. I do, at times, find certain aspects of a body attractive... but I don't look at them like, "hottdamn lookat'er, hwoo-boy, that there sure is a hottie!" I used to feel outta place when my friends would see a woman up on the TV screen and be talking about her and how hot she is... I never really think that way - it ain't really me. I do judge the looks of woman and men and can decide whether they look good or not, but that doesn't matter much to me. I think relationships should not merely be based on looks. I love for love, not for looks... and I don't put labels on it. I don't call it gay to love a man and I don't say it straight to have a "traditional" relationship... None of that really matters at all - it doesn't matter who puts what where or anything like that. I'm not asexual, gay, straight, or bi... so what am I? Hm, I guess I have no preference. When people ask me, I just tell them... 'It's complicated, ya know?' -- and they really don't know at all. Post by: Rooster on March 08, 2006, 09:32:50 pm
Post by: Mr. FroFox on March 08, 2006, 10:28:34 pm
Lol, never thought of it that way before...... ......nah.
Post by: Party Pony on March 09, 2006, 12:57:20 am Those who proclaim to be only straight or only gay are actually the 'odd ones' mentally cutting off a sexual outlet. He said it was similar to folks who become vegetarians. Since humans are omnivores, mentally stopping the eating of meat is similar to the need of restricting sex partners to only one gender. Post by: Burr on March 09, 2006, 01:12:27 am Who knows though. I think anyone can physically stimulate themselves to anything if they really forced it, but that's different from an innate desire. It's quite clear in research of animals that many have a distinct orientation one way or another, so it's not just a human construct designed to justify a pattern of behavior. Post by: Tabbicus on March 09, 2006, 08:20:19 am
No, we're just not cutting off sexual outlets! Post by: Serra Belvoule on March 09, 2006, 11:14:02 am
I can completely relate... I mean, I have labeled myself asexual, just for the sake of naming it, and looks are not important to me either... But love is very important in my life. (if you don't believe me, go read my stories, they all seem to be about it.) When someone asks me what am I, I answer bi or asexual... though I don't think I'd fit in either concept. THat's why I said last time there should be an "other" option on this kind of polls. ANYWAYS! =n-n= Post by: Blackstripe on March 09, 2006, 02:17:50 pm Post by: Zanner on March 09, 2006, 05:04:11 pm
Facinateing observation Party, but I shall continue to call myself straght thank you very much . Besides, i prefer the -emotional- as well as physical compainionship of a famale rather than a male, i think thats what really makes the diferince, i mean either way ya can still *ahem* get off, so obviously its emtional (or phycological, whatever you want to call it) as i belive otheres here have already stated.Post by: Savaaha on March 13, 2006, 02:33:22 pm Post by: Kayf on March 13, 2006, 06:53:28 pm I can look at an attractive man and say "Yes, he's kinda hot," but I don't think I would really want to do anything with him.
Post by: Karizma on March 14, 2006, 09:04:33 am I've been bi, I've been asexual, and now I claim to be gay. But I must confess: Whenever I do "check out" a guy, it's not instinctive. All my girlfriends will gawk at a guy who's cute, but for some reason that just doesn't fit me, and I've been--... I've been lying to myself recently. I've been forcing myself to look at guys. I don't find really much physical attraction to anyone. The first thing that I actually think about, oddly, isn't looks at all... OR "heart." The first thing that actually catches my attention on judging a guy is the voice. I have NO idea why, but if I like his voice, I then take interest in him. This is actually one of the reasons I've avoided relationships at school (... besides there only being like... only one more guy >>' ) Sound catches my attention Look catches my appeal Depth catches my heart Post by: silup on March 14, 2006, 05:32:26 pm Post by: Lost Cat on March 15, 2006, 08:06:16 pm
Post by: Party Pony on March 17, 2006, 12:53:48 am
Actually a number of my friends joke that I am a 'voice queen'. My favorite animated characters are the ones that have "appealing" voices. In fact, I can put up with an ugly, poorly animated, lame cartoon if at least one of the characters has a "neat" voice. There can be something soothing about a friendly voice or accent. Really like Aussie accents and soft British ones. Post by: Kwan on March 17, 2006, 02:27:23 am
I'm big on voices, too! My idea of heaven: me lounging in a hot-tub with Patrick Stewart, James Earl Jones, Morgan Freeman, and Keith David taking turns reading out loud to me. ~~~<:3 Doesn't matter what they're reading. Could be the phone book for all I care. To be fair, I have to say that Kathleen Turner & Lauren Bacall have GREAT voices. So, maybe they can read a little while I'm doing chores. Nice to hear, but not as distracting for me. <;3 And Karizma, I wouldn't stress over not ogling. Different things attract different people. I tend to not ogle guys either, because I'm attracted to brains. Which means I have to get to know someone before I'm full-blown gonzo attracted to them (and by that time we're friends & he sees me as a sister 8-B). >.> <.< A lot of furries are brainy. Gay, but brainy. Post by: Mr. FroFox on March 19, 2006, 09:51:27 am
Soft british accents are some of my favorites. Do we remember Olivia from the Great Mouse Detective? Too adorable!
Post by: Savaaha on March 19, 2006, 08:49:01 pm Post by: Karizma on March 19, 2006, 09:19:04 pm
May I borrow your imagination? and to the last two lines... *facepalm* Post by: Kwan on March 20, 2006, 02:21:41 am
Yes, but wash it before you give it back this time. >.> <.< ...You might need to use oven cleaner. Post by: TheComet on April 05, 2006, 09:28:06 pm Post by: Diego Wolfwood on April 20, 2006, 01:23:59 am Post by: Zanner on April 24, 2006, 12:13:56 am *joins the straght bandwagon* woot Post by: Canix on May 03, 2006, 07:19:12 pm Yup, I love the lady's.
Post by: Xander on May 03, 2006, 07:43:44 pm ...but I think I would prefer my life partner to be female because I want some little ones at some point <voted bi> Post by: Dixie Landoe on May 18, 2006, 05:51:56 pm
woooooooooooooow... take a look at me 1.5 years ago, and then see just how much of a loop I've been through, lol! I think it's this here furry stuff that's messin' with ma mind, showing me how downright sexy male antelope are *Toby Keith's How Do You Like Me Now? plays in the background* Post by: Ears on May 19, 2006, 12:30:45 am
Post by: 466314 on May 28, 2006, 10:18:26 am but I do express my furryness outside in the world, even if my friends think's its strange, but its no differnt then being a skater or so what Post by: Varden on May 31, 2006, 06:13:49 pm I don't really believe you can flat out say your gay or straight though I might just be tallking out of my ###. People change though, you might find someone you never would have expected to like being the love of your life and then what would you call yourself? No I don't really like calling my sexuality anything, it is what it is and means I can be attracted to someone without questioning myself about it. Post by: Adrius on May 31, 2006, 06:49:07 pm Post by: Ralfie de Wolfie on June 03, 2006, 08:48:05 pm Once in a while I see someone gay, but of course it doesn't bother me, he's a person, just like me. And at times I actually feel good for them since they usually seem to be so happy (I guess that's where they came up with the term happy). And at times, guys who are straight sometimes get sad or depressed when they see a girl they like, but are not sure what to do since they do not fully understand what they are like (or their intentions). But then the gay guys, they have nothing to worry about because they already know the intentions of each other, which probably makes it so much easier to find a mate. And I guess for people who are bi, there are just simply more options.
Post by: Albino From About on June 04, 2006, 01:48:28 pm Post by: Yip on June 04, 2006, 02:07:47 pm
Except for problems of finding out whether someone you are interested in is actualy gay or not. Since often it's not something you can just ask since some people would get very offended by that. Plus everyone is different so you still never know each others intentions for sure. That's why communication is so important. (And that applies to any relationship, not just for those that are gay) But I guess it depends on the situation really. Post by: Gwyndolium on June 05, 2006, 07:34:54 am gay is losing.. And I'm one.. 99th vote from me! Yeah oh well.. I thought to be bi last year but fooled myself too much.. (although furry females are nicer than humans to look at) And am pretty darn gay now.. Not that anybody notices. Well heck they always think I'm straight. Post by: Howlie Tigerpaw on June 07, 2006, 01:23:03 pm Post by: Party Pony on June 17, 2006, 07:59:28 pm
Must admit the subline is a bit confusing... "Are furrys really 90% gay?" I mean... if furs were 50% gay, would that make them bi? Post by: Saber on June 21, 2006, 12:15:04 am On that note, I think it's great how many of you here are open with your sexuality. Good for you all. Post by: 466314 on July 06, 2006, 01:38:35 pm I'm straight, I do act like huggle person and I like reciving hugs and giving, but i have done a couple of things which isn't straight ish (non-pg, and partly for fun) but yeah i am more turned to girls and nothing for boys. Post by: Real Sorceror on July 09, 2006, 08:47:17 pm I dont wanna sound crude or anything, but five minutes of the Discovery Channels lets you know that animals enjoy doing "it", and they dont care if anyone is watching(even if its us nosy humans and our camera crews) Post by: Dixie Landoe on July 10, 2006, 04:24:00 pm
hm... statistically they would be! however, this does make me remember something a friend told me once - that "everybody is gay to some extent; it's just to what degree they are that determines their true orientation." don't ask me to explain that - my response could very well go off into adult territory
Post by: Mango on July 10, 2006, 04:35:33 pm Post by: Gwyndolium on July 11, 2006, 02:12:21 am
It's true.. I could like women for their being but just not the body as gay. It's not like I can only like man or something, that would be naive. Post by: Mr. FroFox on July 11, 2006, 02:39:47 am
Heh, but if we were to consider everyone gay to a degree, where would that leave the definition of straight? Sound sort of like the teacher's old ace in the whole, everyone is special, meaning no one is. I believe that everyone has the potencial for little nuances of physical attraction to or admiration of the same sex, but I hardly think that would warrent the label gay outright. I think sexuality is in most cases a bit more concrete than that. But heh, this coming from a currently still somewhat sexually ambiguous fox, what do I know?
Post by: Seraline on July 27, 2006, 04:44:46 pm
Post by: Dickie on July 29, 2006, 11:32:11 pm Post by: Storm Fox on August 05, 2006, 05:45:06 pm btw The computer said thanks for voting, But I never entered a vote and now I can’t, I guess it’s null , Don’t really know. Post by: Sora-kun on August 26, 2006, 07:45:04 pm Post by: elixerboi on September 07, 2006, 07:09:16 pm so if this has been said (which probably has), then just bear with me it is true that the fandom used to be (not as much as 90%) dominated by gays and some bi, but that's definitly not true now as you can see by the amount of straight furs here as for me i'm straight, but i still do like to give hugs, cuddle, and online i sometimes have some non-straight fun much like paw-fox ^^;; real life however i have no attraction to men (and unfortunatly i live in a time where most females around my age act like sluts) Post by: Maxx on September 12, 2006, 08:01:06 pm When I was younger I always beleived myself to like girls, but after a while, it turned out I only "liked" them because of their..."appearance", if you know what I mean. For the following years I find myself leaning more and more towards guys and less and less on girls, so much that I feel un-comfortable with girls all together. Not that I'm sexist or setting certain prejudiced beleifs against them, I still like girls as friends and I like talking with the girls that happen to be friends of my sister, I just feel that I'd be more comfortable with the same sex because I have a certain attraction towards masculanity(sp?), guys are usually with lovely character, and...erm...more good-looking than girls, in my eyes. Some people might call it "laziness" or just being "scared" to talk to girls, but in all honesty, I say I feel just as "scared" talking to a boy like a regular school-kid is at talking to a girl he "really" likes. Post by: Miles Feral on September 12, 2006, 09:23:45 pm Maybe it only seems like more furries are gay because the queer side is more outspoken? It's one thing I don't really like about us, the whole, "I'm here and I'm queer" thing. Straight people don't have parades.... do they?! And if you bring up all the "gay smut," don't forget that (for some freaky odd reason) many straight girls help perpetuate the genre. In fact, the Shonen Ai and Yaoi (Gay Manga) genres of comics strated and are still very much kept in production by straight girls. Weird no? I guess it's the same mentality straight guys have about seeing two women go at it... Maybe we're all a little bit gay on the inside? Anyone? No? Okay
Post by: Burr on September 13, 2006, 12:12:16 am
Straight people don't have oppression or are made to feel shame either, right? A lot of their popular behaviors are essentially a parade of their sexuality too if you haven't noticed, it just doesn't seem that way since it's taken for granted and is so common. (For example, how easily could a conversation go like this? "Oh man that chick is so hot I'd do her right now, what about you?" "Actually I have a boyfriend.." "Hey man stop parading your sexuality around!" Personally I've seen such hypocrisy firsthand a few times..) Not that I'm much into the pride thing myself. I'd rather just rationally argue for rights and comport myself normally in every other way, but to pin all the exuberance on one side isn't exactly fair, and there is definitely a point to it that has also achieved plenty of political success and social acceptance despite all the vocal hand-wringing over it, which is why even though I had trouble accepting it at first as well I've come to appreciate some of the things the "I'm here and I'm queer" crowd has acccomplished. Post by: Dekri on September 15, 2006, 02:36:53 am Post by: LilZero on September 15, 2006, 06:12:44 am Straight as a whistle. ^_~ Post by: Mock on September 18, 2006, 02:25:52 am
Don't whistles have little curves that go into a circle at the end -Mock Post by: Xander_Taron on September 19, 2006, 09:28:52 pm
Well put. Post by: Vincent Mercer on September 19, 2006, 09:38:30 pm Also I voted straight I'v np with people who our gay but I'd rather be with a women in the long wrong of things. Post by: Broman on September 21, 2006, 12:32:22 pm
I disagree wholeheartedly, I am straight, first off. I don't mind hugging other guys at all, but that's for reasons other than sexuality, such as friendship, i think there is a clearly defined line that connotates whether you are having a relationship as a friend or as a sexual partner. But because of that i can still say i'm straight and still have good (not sexual) friendships with other guys. As for the cultural mindset, it's based more and more on free choice as far as sexual establishment goes. All the same, looking at those results astound me at the population of gay and bi's in furdom (i'm not discriminating just pointing out fact) Post by: Dark Nation on September 25, 2006, 08:25:21 pm
Post by: Tolgron on September 26, 2006, 02:43:50 pm Post by: Gyp on September 28, 2006, 05:18:43 am Straight as an arrow. Looks like your 90% figure is a little off... it's really more, like, 18% gay. Post by: Dark Nation on September 28, 2006, 05:49:52 am Post by: Gyp on September 28, 2006, 07:08:27 am Statistically speaking, however, with an accurate sample and sample size, a fraction of furries should speak quite well for the whole. How much of furry society do you think is represented here on Furtopia? Post by: Dark Nation on September 28, 2006, 08:34:15 am Post by: Orange on September 30, 2006, 05:59:27 am If only girls in real life were more like the girls I knew on the internet. Post by: Firehazard on October 09, 2006, 10:04:57 pm
Well, why do you think online relationships are so popular?
Post by: Dark Nation on October 09, 2006, 10:07:21 pm
Problem comes when the 'woman' you've been getting to know for *Insert time length here* and have become very attatched to turns out to be a 50 year old man...  Post by: The Unforgiven on October 10, 2006, 10:03:59 pm Post by: kitkitsune on October 14, 2006, 06:05:12 pm it dosn't matter to me who anyone likes wether it be guy/guy girl/girl or girl/guy as long as they are nice people and treat their mates right (personaly.....I like both genders) Post by: Furkee on November 14, 2006, 04:07:50 am
Post by: on November 20, 2006, 08:22:26 am Post by: Jamel Fireflye Sno'cat on November 22, 2006, 05:57:13 am edit: if you go on pounced.org most of the people on there are either gay or bi theres not many straight furs on that site so maybe its just furtopia that is dominated by straight people? Post by: Rozga on November 22, 2006, 09:58:20 pm ~Rozga Post by: Pepper Porcupine on November 25, 2006, 02:53:38 am Don't laugh it's true!Post by: Moon-Baby on November 25, 2006, 08:29:40 pm So I guess While I'd be much more inclined towards guys, I'm Bi. Post by: Tassel on November 25, 2006, 08:47:33 pm -Tassel Post by: [Howl] on November 26, 2006, 01:48:40 am
Post by: Foxxhoria on November 30, 2006, 03:54:30 pm Thank you <:::Foxx:::> Post by: Moon-Baby on November 30, 2006, 04:47:49 pm
That's because sex isnt just for breeding, it's also used to secure social bonds and friendships, and, I was suprised too, but theres a whole giant list somewhere with other animals that have homosexual individuals in the species. It's more often than not that an animal is Bi, though. Without going into detail because...>_>.....yeah. There's lots of stuff I found some places. There's a pretty famous article of some penguins. Post by: Canix on November 30, 2006, 05:37:20 pm
Naturally, thats to be expected. Don't pay attention to stereotypes. Voted Straight here. Post by: Kaht on November 30, 2006, 06:17:26 pm
Gay penguins? Well...that's a new one to me... *voted bi* Post by: NachtwolfES on November 30, 2006, 06:37:23 pm Post by: Dark Nation on November 30, 2006, 06:47:15 pm
1: Breeding doesn't come into the equation anymore. How often do you hear of two people meeting in a bar and deciding "Hey I have an idea, lets help populate the species". Never. Love is about a bond between two people and sex is a way for them to show their true feelings for one another, same sex or not. 2:Many couple do not want children because of the restrictions it can place on a relationship (Financial etc) And who's to say a few less future humans would be a bad thing?
Post by: Foxxhoria on December 02, 2006, 07:14:52 am
Ahah... Yes... Thats nice to know, thank you. I wasn't quite sure the response I'd get, and I am suprised that animals can be homosexual. I know that wolves hump others to show dominance...so I guess it makes sense. Thank you Post by: Corax on December 03, 2006, 12:23:13 am Post by: Alex the lion on December 06, 2006, 02:03:10 am I think this is a good sample of what it is like in real life for the fandom. As for children I want to have children one day. Post by: Ziba the lioness on December 16, 2006, 03:57:58 pm And as far as children go I already have one, a four year old daugter and I of course want more kids Post by: Arc on December 17, 2006, 12:56:48 am Post by: Subcon on December 17, 2006, 09:40:54 am Post by: Bacn Blackstripe on December 17, 2006, 10:49:18 am Post by: Nahari_Thornpaw on December 18, 2006, 08:46:08 pm
Post by: SerFox on December 24, 2006, 10:14:04 pm Post by: zachhart12 on December 25, 2006, 04:59:16 pm Post by: Gwyndolium on December 25, 2006, 06:24:36 pm Post by: Jay_Fox on December 30, 2006, 04:49:50 pm I pulled a funny! I'm bisexual. I'm proud of it! I get the best of both worlds!
Post by: Kris on February 08, 2007, 05:56:52 pm
Post by: newbfur on February 08, 2007, 06:14:50 pm lol, anyways i didnt really vote. Post by: David_Night on February 25, 2007, 11:14:23 pm I myself am gay (but closeted, go fig), and i might want to have 1 kid some day, assuming i met the right person and they wouldn't warp the kids mind to bad. Post by: Xeen on March 02, 2007, 01:43:21 pm Post by: Dark Nation on March 07, 2007, 10:04:08 am
But I thought you loved me.
Post by: Canix on March 07, 2007, 12:16:35 pm
No love for you. 
Post by: Vivian on March 08, 2007, 10:12:55 pm and I want for nothing else. So, straight.
Post by: Arc on March 08, 2007, 10:48:17 pm
Well of course I love YOU. <3 Post by: Mango on March 09, 2007, 08:05:39 am
Oh. I see how it is. I don't believe I've posted in this topic yet. I'm heterosexual. Post by: Icewolf on March 21, 2007, 12:52:43 pm Post by: Kondha on March 27, 2007, 09:04:49 pm but i just don't find the idea of dating a female very enticing; so i am straight. Post by: on March 27, 2007, 11:54:41 pm Post by: unci on April 24, 2007, 06:18:26 pm Post by: huskyboy on April 27, 2007, 04:20:24 pm Post by: PawsOfFate on April 29, 2007, 02:55:43 am Post by: Vulpyro on April 29, 2007, 11:06:19 am Post by: Orlith on May 01, 2007, 05:41:26 pm )
Post by: Vulpin on May 04, 2007, 08:40:43 pm I play out scenarios in my mind, but I've no desire to do such myself. Plus, my girlfriend wouldn't really like that...
Post by: Kigurou Sonkei on May 05, 2007, 09:18:18 am Also, another reason I'm straight? I'm slightly homophobic. They scare me, sometimes... Though I'm growing more open, and able to accept all types of people. Post by: Vulpin on May 07, 2007, 09:53:03 pm Post by: CuddlyLion on May 12, 2007, 06:10:44 am Up until...september, I totally thought myself straigt. Then I started having these feelings for a girl, but I surpressed them, telling myself I just loved her as a friend. Then, around christmas they came back, and the end there was no denying it. Luckily, I now have a very nice girlfriend, so...
Post by: Ehsteve on May 12, 2007, 10:18:02 am Post by: Epsy on May 22, 2007, 07:38:39 pm Post by: Lucifurre on May 22, 2007, 08:35:10 pm ) Surprised to see so many of us breeders here. Re: asexual, in conventional english, despite the movement to reinvent the term, asexual strongly connotes lack of sexual organs, or by extrapolation, a lack of any sexual interests or behaviors of any kind, which in my experience in discussing it with people calling themselves asexuals, almost never the case, which makes asexual, for describing people uninterested in having partners (or even gratification), a very unfortunate choice of words, among other things because it usually leads to a lot of nasty & stupid remarks and speculation about the people using the term that way to describe themselves. It would have been nice to see a "no interest in sex with guys or gals" category though-- those folks ought to count, same way we atheists should be allowed to count in a poll on religion. Post by: lunarlight555 on May 23, 2007, 12:07:46 pm
Post by: August on May 25, 2007, 01:54:39 pm Man: "I'm not gay, I just have sex with men." Being gay means that you are willing to enter a relationship with someone of the same gender, not just engage in sexual activity. As humans, going by Darwin's ideas, are animalistic, sexual drive is a natural response. . .which makes sense that most people will, at some point in their life, be attracted, at least physically responsive, to someone of the same sex. As for being straight, gay, or bi, that comes down to preference in dealing with relationships. Personally I identify as pansexual, for the sake of argument I'll say I'm bisexual. Post by: MorbidCorvid on May 27, 2007, 11:53:38 am I'm closest to pansexual than any other stereotyped attention seeking sexuality i've heard of. I have a boyfriend now, though. So i guess i'm gay now. :]
No. Attraction to the same sex in the animal kingdom is a fault of nature and has no benefits. It happens in humans more often than not due to emotional/mental reasons.
I want to know when the using of the term asexual was used to discuss human sexuality. It means a female capable of breeding without the need of a male. Asexual reproduction. Cloning. Post by: Epsy on May 27, 2007, 12:13:57 pm
Just because your not straight doesnt mean your seeking attention =/ Post by: MorbidCorvid on May 27, 2007, 12:46:41 pm Sometimes i'm afraid to say how i feel because the other person may think i'm being attention seeking. Do you know what i mean now a bit better? Post by: Epsy on May 27, 2007, 12:58:14 pm
Oh wait, I get it now. The way you phrased it kinda confused me. Sorry. Post by: on June 12, 2007, 02:55:00 am
Post by: Kojac on June 12, 2007, 04:00:08 am As a side bar, I read an article that a vast majority of the population has some homosexual tendencies or has thought about being in a relationship with the same gender at some point, so I don't necessarily believe that human sexuality is as clean-cut as simply straight, gay, or bi. I also want to have kids of my own some day, so that also kinda limits my choices a bit Post by: TigerStripe on June 12, 2007, 04:48:15 am I'm 50/50 to both. Post by: Neon Knight on June 12, 2007, 06:32:34 pm
That, well...perfectly explains me. Post by: Sonho on June 13, 2007, 12:02:10 pm Post by: Priest on June 18, 2007, 04:33:56 pm Post by: Kobo-Kun on June 26, 2007, 11:02:27 pm Post by: Epsy on June 26, 2007, 11:09:20 pm
You dont have to force yourself into a sexuality, just dont worry about it. Post by: Hanai on July 14, 2007, 10:02:50 pm Tried the whole guy thing before but it didn't really work out.I'm kinda surprised at the results though, I would have figured at least 60% would be gay (and male, lol). It's probably because Furtopia attracts a more general demographic or something. I know other boards I go to, the balance is something like 90% gay, 9% bi and 1% straight
Post by: TehLeonTaz on July 14, 2007, 11:33:26 pm I don't know what to answer, since I'm actually unsure... Post by: DaveTheKing on July 25, 2007, 06:17:19 pm Post by: Psylent Wulf on July 25, 2007, 06:57:56 pm Post by: Gyr633 on July 29, 2007, 10:38:24 pm Post by: Dex01 on August 20, 2007, 02:15:50 pm I did go through a bit of a phase when I was younger but I didn't like it much and i decided that I'd stick to the girls
Post by: Fangz on August 21, 2007, 05:40:49 am but this is a hard one for me dunno why. Also I think I'm toworried about what other ppl thinks too give a finnal statement on this area. gota skip voting ^^
Post by: Serra Belvoule on September 09, 2007, 09:13:33 pm
Keep in mind that approx. 50% of people have a opposite-orientation experience in their lives. -I'll get the source of this statistics as soon as I remember where i read this from.- Post by: Lascivus_Lutra on September 20, 2007, 02:33:57 pm Post by: Sskessa on September 20, 2007, 04:16:44 pm Post by: Lascivus_Lutra on September 20, 2007, 04:25:19 pm
yes! that is where it was. and here is the link Gay by Choice? Should anyone decide to read this, please read the whole thing. It does a good job of looking at both sides of the issue. Post by: Epsy on September 22, 2007, 11:40:06 am
I thought the Oedipus complex had been officially debunked. Post by: on September 22, 2007, 12:59:40 pm
Haha, memories Is it too late to change my vote? Post by: Sskessa on September 22, 2007, 02:37:01 pm
Did you read the whole thing? They're just presenting that the way he believes it. Post by: Traumerei on September 22, 2007, 10:54:07 pm Post by: Yip on September 23, 2007, 12:15:38 am
Well, I know that at least in some cases people changing how they would vote here is caused not by any real change but by getting to know themselves better. I know this is the case for me. Back when I voted on this thing I was still in denial about being gay. Also people that are closer to true bi could easily appear to shift like that. For some of them sexual orientation may be more of a choice. Or they might find themselves pulled this way any that by their feelings. I know I call myself gay, but sometimes I find myself turned on by females. That seems to come and go though, and most the time I find they are more of a turn off than a turn on. So maybe there is a bit of truth to this shifting stuff. Sexuality is by no means a simple thing. Post by: on September 23, 2007, 01:25:21 pm
I really was into girls before Its really strange because I was straight (had basically no interest in guys) then before I posted that, for about two years I wasn't really interested in *anyone* and now I'm gay *shrugs* You can tell from my post back in 2004 that I never really liked to define myself. I don't know if you'd really consider me gay or bi -- I guess I could still force myself to out with a girl and could probably somewhat ejoy it, but that's not what interests me so I'm only dating guys now... I guess that is a choice but the way I feel is obviously not. This could still all change (but I doubt it) so who knows? I'm sticking to the premise I won't define myself -- that would only serve to limit my options, anyway. Post by: Kiska Nirpaw on September 24, 2007, 02:29:52 pm I figure my soulmate is my soulmate, gender aside. Tho the guy I'm with now, I'm pretty sure he fits that bill
Post by: Fen-Fen on October 05, 2007, 11:10:34 pm I wish I could have nulled my vote though. At first I voted I was "bisexual" though right now I'm thinking I'm actually straight. But of course, I have the rest of my life to find this out (or not) . I'm fine with not knowing my sexuality. I'll love who I want to love. But I think I've found my soul mate. :3 Post by: Kos on October 06, 2007, 01:54:35 am Myself for instance, I'm a 2 on the Kinsey Scale (still not punning.) I'm much more likely to be attracted to females, but I'm open to the male aesthetic and would have no hesitance in accepting a male partner should I feel he is the one for me. I shy away from calling myself purely bi-sexual because I feel I don't quite fit the Bill (ok, a little pun there.) Maybe other posters can understand what I mean by that? Post by: Holley on October 06, 2007, 06:59:29 am Post by: Brody on October 06, 2007, 11:18:31 am
Yeah, that is the obvious image problem with the fandom - it's not the gayness that squicks non-furs, it's the openness. Post by: Fen-Fen on October 06, 2007, 11:56:32 pm
I can. That's how I feel entirely. In fact, a friend of mine was doing a report on sexuality for a class and I took a survey she had. It was my first introduction to the Kinsey-Scale and I felt that I was a 2. At that time though, I felt the NEED to identify myself with a sexuality label. Now, I know better. :\ Post by: Mac on October 13, 2007, 07:28:00 pm Post by: Savaaha on October 16, 2007, 09:29:41 pm Updated poll is HERE |