Author Topic: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?  (Read 3437 times)

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Offline Mr. Apple

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #25 on: January 12, 2012, 12:56:02 am »
Well if time travel were to be accomplished, the most likely way of doing so would be to traverse the multiverse. Pretty much hop from dimension to dimension according to which version of reality you wanted to travel to since every moment in time has a dimension. This means, though that whatever you do to affect that dimension would be isolated to that specific instance making the possibility of a paradox nonexistent. So yeah, it's probable that something like that could be done since there's a lot of stuff out there we still can't explain. And if we could, then I think we should. And if there happened to be a paradox, we wouldn't even know it since we would've already been living that paradox.


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Offline Yip

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #26 on: January 17, 2012, 06:27:12 am »
I do not believe that time travel, if it's possible, is something to be feared; if someone in the future could go to the past and cause millions to cease to exist then they would have done so already.

Offline Storm Fox

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2012, 04:09:33 am »
I do not believe that time travel, if it's possible, is something to be feared; if someone in the future could go to the past and cause millions to cease to exist then they would have done so already.
And if that were to happen or has happened, you, me, and everyone else would never even know.
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Offline Ice Sage

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #28 on: January 21, 2012, 10:30:13 pm »
I believe that time travel is impossible, and even if it was possible, very bad of an idea. I believe it is impossible because I believe that time is ment to be that passage of when things happen, not something that is constantly recording everything everywhere and can be manipulated to your whim. If it was possible, traveling back would cause differences in what happens, possible causing you to not have a need to travel back to that exact moment or you not being able to, which would cause a paradox, and be very bad. I know this isn't the best way I could have worded that, but I hope you understand it.

 

Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #29 on: January 22, 2012, 02:01:10 am »
I have no clue whether time travel is possible or not.  However, I think one kind of time travel has been highly neglected in all kinds of writing and films. I'm not even sure if I've seen it in anything.  Someone probably thought of this before, but I think it'd be the most likely thing to exist. 

Everything in the world constantly moves. If we go forward in time, everything moves forward in its own way.  If we move backwards, everything moves backwards.  However, in this type of time travel, we would allow one thing to go forward while the rest of the universe goes backwards.  In this manner, if you traveled back in time to before you were born, your time in school, your childhood, and even your birth would be undone. Traveling forward in time again, you would no longer be able to be born to your parents because, simply, you are an adult.  If they had a child, they would have memories with that one, not you. 

Depending on the way it's done, this kind of time travel could be safe or catastrophic.  You as a time traveler would lose your connection with everyone depending on how far you traveled in time, and removing matter from the general flow of things could cause really weird problems to occur.
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Offline Yip

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2012, 02:25:24 pm »
Everything in the world constantly moves. If we go forward in time, everything moves forward in its own way.  If we move backwards, everything moves backwards.  However, in this type of time travel, we would allow one thing to go forward while the rest of the universe goes backwards.  In this manner, if you traveled back in time to before you were born, your time in school, your childhood, and even your birth would be undone. Traveling forward in time again, you would no longer be able to be born to your parents because, simply, you are an adult.  If they had a child, they would have memories with that one, not you. 

Depending on the way it's done, this kind of time travel could be safe or catastrophic.  You as a time traveler would lose your connection with everyone depending on how far you traveled in time, and removing matter from the general flow of things could cause really weird problems to occur.
With that kind of time travel, it could mean that the moment you start to go back in time, your molecules would run into the molecules of your previous self. And you'd have the same running-into-yourself problem when you start going forward again. And in between, everyone else would see you moving backwards.

Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2012, 04:18:56 pm »
With that kind of time travel, it could mean that the moment you start to go back in time, your molecules would run into the molecules of your previous self. And you'd have the same running-into-yourself problem when you start going forward again. And in between, everyone else would see you moving backwards.
Not quite, Vararam. Law of conservation of mass states that the same molecules cannot exist in two places at once.  Because of that, going back in time would not cause you to be in the same place as a separate you. It eliminates the possibility of a duplicate self because, simply put, there can only be one of you.

Also, people would not see you traveling back in time.  As you went back, the events in the world around you would proceed backwards.  Once you got to your set destination in time, you begin to move forward. There would not be a duplicate you later on traveling backwards because there can only be one you.  I don't know if that makes sense =/
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Offline Kobuk

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2012, 04:27:39 pm »
Quote
Law of conservation of mass states that the same molecules cannot exist in two places at once.

Wasn't it Einstein who also said that no two objects or people can be in the same place at the same time?

Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2012, 04:40:23 pm »
Quote
Law of conservation of mass states that the same molecules cannot exist in two places at once.

Wasn't it Einstein who also said that no two objects or people can be in the same place at the same time?
That's exactly what I'm saying, Kobuk. With this kind of time travel, going back in time would not allow for any duplicates to appear.
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Offline aspect

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2012, 05:11:01 pm »
I believe it is impossible because I believe that time is ment to be that passage of when things happen, not something that is constantly recording everything everywhere and can be manipulated to your whim.

Because of both special and general relativity being true we know that there is no absolute "now," which immediately implies that the past and future must literally exist. Brian Green gives a good explanation of this in this Nova episode. (Maybe around 18 minutes in? I'm trying to find the spot without using sound :P )

I have no clue whether time travel is possible or not.  However, I think one kind of time travel has been highly neglected in all kinds of writing and films. I'm not even sure if I've seen it in anything.  Someone probably thought of this before, but I think it'd be the most likely thing to exist. 
...

I'm definitely not sure I understand the proposal here. At first I thought you were proposing something close to Kurt Vonnegut's Slaughterhouse Five, where your conscious awareness is the thing moving back and forth rather than your body. But I can see that's not what you mean...

So basically, if you travelled say two years back in time, the subjective appearance to everyone else would be that at that past moment of arrival, you suddenly age two years and gain new memories? Or are you saying you would appear to disappear, while the future self appeared somewhere else?

The rule of 'you can't be in two places at once' really only applies to individual particles (ignoring quantum theory for the moment), so if that is in fact what you're imagining, really what would "age two years" or disappear and reappear somewhere else would be individual particles-- not even whole atoms, since constituent electrons of atoms are often exchanged. The figure frequently given is around 7 years for total replacement; so travel back more than that and your previous self wouldn't disappear at all. Instead, random atoms from atmosphere, dirt, and other people would disappear. Travel back less than seven years, and only some parts of the previous self would 'disappear'; most likely parts which exchange materials only slowly, such as your bones.

Truly a problematic model of time travel! Hopefully physics doesn't allow it; I don't want my future self stealing my bones!

Offline Yip

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #35 on: January 23, 2012, 02:48:48 am »
Not quite, Vararam. Law of conservation of mass states that the same molecules cannot exist in two places at once. 
Then if I'm understanding this time travel idea you proposed, that same Law of conservation would mean the whole time travel thing is not possible.  Either that or I'm totally not understanding what your previous post was talking about.

You said, "...we would allow one thing to go forward while the rest of the universe goes backwards." Would not those that are "going backwards" not realize they are going backwards? It seems to me that from their perspective time would be going forward. Thus the one that is "going forward" would to them look to be going backwards.  (Granted we can't actually choose or "allow" the universe to go backwards, but I'm forgiving that for the sake of argument.)

Offline Old Rabbit

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #36 on: January 23, 2012, 12:08:51 pm »
Well if time travel were to be accomplished, the most likely way of doing so would be to traverse the multiverse. Pretty much hop from dimension to dimension according to which version of reality you wanted to travel to since every moment in time has a dimension. This means, though that whatever you do to affect that dimension would be isolated to that specific instance making the possibility of a paradox nonexistent. So yeah, it's probable that something like that could be done since there's a lot of stuff out there we still can't explain. And if we could, then I think we should. And if there happened to be a paradox, we wouldn't even know it since we would've already been living that paradox.


my mind... I tried to understand but now i broken... srry people i did my best x.x

I have wondered about this myself.  Each action or decision moves us
in a different direction.  Moving through dimensions of time and space.

So we flow through time in endless directions. Heck I might even be
a rabbit in some dimension. :orbunny:

So if one could travel to the dimension of choice anything might be
possible and no paradoxes. Course that would create another reality. :P

Just my thoughts, but rather mind bending at least.

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Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #37 on: January 23, 2012, 02:12:52 pm »
You said, "...we would allow one thing to go forward while the rest of the universe goes backwards." Would not those that are "going backwards" not realize they are going backwards? It seems to me that from their perspective time would be going forward.
I'm realizing that I'm having a much harder time explaining it than I thought :D

Anyway, think about it -- for those people going backwards, light instead of going into their eyes will instead be leaving.  Actions they had once done would instead be reversed and undone, including thought processes.  For them, there would be no perception that time is changing for they will have no perception at all; instead, all perceptions they had up to that point would start to be undone.

For example, let's say I stand on the street and throw a rock at the time traveler.  If he begins to go backwards in time, the rock will return to me, and my memory of throwing it will disappear; in addition, I won't see him traveling back in time because light will be leaving from within my eye and memories are disappearing rather than being made.  If he then stopped traveling back in time while standing directly in front of me, I will perceive that he suddenly appeared there.  Because of this process of undoing memory as I go backwards, I would be unable to perceive that this is happening.
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Offline Yip

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #38 on: January 23, 2012, 02:47:37 pm »
@Alexandre
Are you saying that time is still going forward but the only the cause-effect chain of time is going backwards?

Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #39 on: January 23, 2012, 03:16:27 pm »
@Alexandre
Are you saying that time is still going forward but the only the cause-effect chain of time is going backwards?
I suppose you could put it that way, but since people judge time based on cause-effect, I was using that as the unit of measure.  Honestly, it's easier to think of this time travel by forgetting about "time."  Yes, I'd say it's the reversal of the cause-effect chain.
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Offline aspect

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #40 on: January 23, 2012, 03:19:59 pm »
I suppose you could put it that way, but since people judge time based on cause-effect, I was using that as the unit of measure.  Honestly, it's easier to think of this time travel by forgetting about "time."  Yes, I'd say it's the reversal of the cause-effect chain.

But if the reversal were perfect, there wouldn't be any effect, right? I mean, going back in time would be rewinding, and you wouldn't remember that you time-traveled and you would relive the reversed years almost precisely the same as they had gone the first time.

Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #41 on: January 23, 2012, 03:33:06 pm »
I suppose you could put it that way, but since people judge time based on cause-effect, I was using that as the unit of measure.  Honestly, it's easier to think of this time travel by forgetting about "time."  Yes, I'd say it's the reversal of the cause-effect chain.

But if the reversal were perfect, there wouldn't be any effect, right? I mean, going back in time would be rewinding, and you wouldn't remember that you time-traveled and you would relive the reversed years almost precisely the same as they had gone the first time.
Not quite.  The way that it would work, you would remove yourself from the cause-effect chain.  While everything else rewinds, your cause-effect chain goes forwards. In other words, as the world around you gets younger, you still get older.
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Offline DreamerHusky

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #42 on: January 23, 2012, 05:26:32 pm »
...
« Last Edit: December 22, 2014, 03:38:51 pm by DreamerHusky »

Offline Kobuk

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #43 on: January 23, 2012, 05:49:00 pm »
The best way to experience time travel!  :D  :D


Offline Alexandre

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #44 on: January 23, 2012, 07:17:33 pm »
The best way to experience time travel!  :D  :D


I completely agree! However, I'm pretty fond of this one:

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Offline aspect

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #45 on: January 23, 2012, 07:20:03 pm »
But if the reversal were perfect, there wouldn't be any effect, right? I mean, going back in time would be rewinding, and you wouldn't remember that you time-traveled and you would relive the reversed years almost precisely the same as they had gone the first time.
Not quite.  The way that it would work, you would remove yourself from the cause-effect chain.  While everything else rewinds, your cause-effect chain goes forwards. In other words, as the world around you gets younger, you still get older.

OH ok! So I stand by my earlier post, traveling back in time a few years would result in teleporting your bones out of your prior self's body.

You said, "...we would allow one thing to go forward while the rest of the universe goes backwards." Would not those that are "going backwards" not realize they are going backwards? It seems to me that from their perspective time would be going forward.

This sounds right to me; if I used this method of time travel I would see stuff rewinding around me but me, or a bubble around me, would be 'normal time'. Well' that's assuming I can see anything at all. Some backwards-traveling light would probably hit my eyes but who knows whether it would get absorbed right?

I think I understand this idea well enough to say a bit about whether it's physically plausible now.

The closest thing to this method that I've actually heard about is the idea that all antimatter is simply matter which is currently traveling backwards in time. So what we perceive as matter and antimatter meeting each other and cancelling out in a burst of energy is, in reality, a piece of matter reversing the direction in which it's travelling. For some reason, forward-traveling matter generates a burst of energy when it's turned backwards in time whereas 'catching' antimatter and turning it back forwards requires energy (we perceive this as a high-energy collision producing a matter-antimatter pair). This is fortunate because otherwise time travel would be a source of free energy! And free energy would (obviously?) unravel spacetime.

Anyway, this time travel method is strange because the first step in accomplishing it is building the receiving machine, and using a huge burst of energy to produce a matter copy of yourself and an antimatter copy of yourself. You then keep the antimatter copy of yourself isolated from any real matter for the duration of its time travel, and then at the end you annihilate yourself using this copy, which is the 'turning around' event.

The existence of the antimatter pair essentially 'balances out' the surplus of you's for the duration of any overlap, which makes a bit more sense to me than the matter being moved to a different location by the time travel.

Naturally we don't know how to create very much antimatter at a time, and creating matter and antimatter duplicates of yourself is no easier than creating, say, an antimatter Klingon, or anything else which doesn't literally come from the future. So for all this to actually retrieve a copy of you from the future, rather than just your best guess at what you-from-the-future is like, the antimatter would have to somehow remain in a state of quantum superposition throughout the whole trip; like Schroedinger's cat only from the future. Looking into the box makes it impossible for the information to have come from the future so prevents time travel.

Since the matter copy of yourself carries the same information as the antimatter copy (at least at the moment of creation), this has a very interesting consequence! The copy of you who travels back in time also has to remain in an isolated box, immune to all measurement, after being created. Only after the original is destroyed or 'turned around' in time to begin the journey could the time traveler actually come out of isolation! Therefore the antimatter method doesn't allow for the time traveler to actually see the past. Instead he just gets some time to himself to think, in a box insulating him from the rest of the Universe.

Offline Ice Sage

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #46 on: January 29, 2012, 09:34:34 pm »
Quote
Law of conservation of mass states that the same molecules cannot exist in two places at once.
I know discussion of this is a bit old, but I would like to contradict this.

The law states that the mass and energy of an isolated system will remain constant over time. An isolated system being where there is no possible way for mass and energy to move in or out of it. Our Earth is far from being an isolated system. Solar energy and meteorites are examples of our mass and energy changing. As stated on Wikipedia: "Truly isolated physical systems do not exist in reality (except perhaps for the universe as a whole), because, for example, there is always gravity between a system with mass, and masses elsewhere."

Even if we concider our system as the universe itself being perfectly isolated, traveling to this point through time travel would mean that we not isolated from movement of mass and energy through time, and that changing the total amount of mass would not have any effects on the rest of it.

 

Offline furtopia02

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Re: Time Travel: Is it possible? Should it be done?
« Reply #47 on: January 30, 2012, 03:11:23 am »
Technically we're all travelling forward in time right now.

I can't really give an educated comment, considering that I know nothing about the subject, whatsoever.

Ever heard of the Multiverse theory? Basically the theories says that you cannot change the the present by stopping an event from taking place in the past, in theory, that would create an alternate existence in the presence. 

It is possibly to travel faster forward in time, I've heard that NASA's shuttle manage to jump a few seconds forward in time as they take off.


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