proud to be... human?

[josh down]

i'm posting this here because i feel it is the main reason that i continue to be a furry, and a proud member of the comunity.

is anyone here actually proud to be human? cause we all are human at the end of the day...

tell you something, i'm not. i think i said why in another topic but i'll say it again... humans are just so materialistic, selfish, greedy, nasty pieces of work that treat everything and everyone else like they don't deserve to walk the earth.

i'd like to think that i'm not like this at all, but i know that i am... all humans are. there's no escape...

which is why i stick with the furry fandom... most people i find and have made friends with are the best friends i have... mainly cause most of my 'human' friends are just as my description... and no human can justify themselves for being like that...

like i think i said before... i don;t wanna turn you all into vegetarian pacifists, i just wanna hear your point of view.

[ontels]

I can see what you mean about humans and allot of people are like that its are nature like most other animals.

but nevertheless I love being a human!
why without humans we wouldn't be talking right now and there would be no such thing as the furry fandom

were the smartest and most dominant species in the world and the moon
sure were not that cute nor do we have cool tails or wing but I am thankful for the things we do have (posable thumbs)

so I like being a human and hope others do to

[Savaaha]

I was born Human in this life so it is the way things are ment to be. I am a furry because I  1.I enjoy its people 2. enjoy the hobby of it 3. its just plain fun.

If I had been meant to be an animal this life I would have been, Do I believe I have an animal spirit? I once did but Ive come to realize spirits do not have a species therefore I cant have an equine one.

[lilfurbal]

No, I am not exactly proud to be a human.  Humans tend to be very hateful things, we seek to kill other humans for no valid reason, we are a race that is incapable of getting along with others.  We're also destroying the planet as we see it, we are overpopulating the planet and pushing animals into extinction as if they have no right to be there.  Wilderness areas are becoming smaller as our cities grow bigger.  This is one reason I do not ever want to have kids, I don't want to contribute to this dominate race.  No other species has put forth so much effort to kill the planet than we have, methinks we still have a thing or two to learn from the animals and we need to lower ourselves to their level, we are animals too.

I am proud of who I am as a person but I'm not proud of being a human. 

[Heaven Implode]

With humanity comes the benefit of being a member of the dominant species, and the benefit of explicit language and reasoning. As an animal, I'd be content but seclusive (at least, from humans) but as a human, I have the ability to make a change to the human population. It's a lot of power for which I'm incredibly grateful, but it's very difficult using it among suppressive government. But I have an extended lifetime to ponder issues like that, which is another thing I'm grateful.

In this case, I'm proud of being human, but I have no pride in belonging to the dominant “social” group that comes with being human.

[josh down]

^^^^

thanks for taking the time to say this.

[Relaxing Dragon]

It's a tough thought on my opinion. On the one hand, I am what I am what I am, and that is a human. It's what I've grown used to being, and I've been pretty happy with it. I don't see Humans in general as being very bad (well, we kinda are, but I see that more a product of sentience than straight-up humanity), and I've grown to accept our many quirks and whatnot.

On the other paw, I somehow find it a lot easier to identify with ther whole Furry concept. Like I've said before, in my mind (and my view of the world), it just fits the puzzle much better. That and I'm finding humanity in general a bit on the dull side. So, overall, I'd say that while I'm perfectly content with my human-ness, I'd probably prefer something a little different (of course, reality is what reality is, so I don't have a lot of choice on the manner).

[Kwan]

Dunno if I'm proud to be human, but I sure as heck like it!

Humans have neat things like air conditioning, ice cream, anime, medicine, opposable thumbs, conventions, and Jackie Chan.  I admit there are other, non-neat things humans are responsible for, but you have to admit there are some pretty darned neat things as well.

[Acton]

Show an animal that can draw a fury (or should it be a fleshie) or a paint a Picasso and one will prove to me humanity is no better.  I perceive one are a person who do not believes in the Judaeo Christian religion, or  perhaps a few other religions here  and there, for one to humanity has no value because  there is no one to give  him value.
It ironic a person seem to despise humanity.  Humanity created furry fandom. It is enough to say the ability to create makes us a little better and proud. Further, more also I refuse to put good  people like Mother Teresa and Martian Luther King on the level of evil people like Hitler. To prophase a cetin rabbi there are two types of people in this would  the decent and the indecent.

You speak of one of my concerns why it took me so long to come out furry. I am very strong with my opposition to some environment and animal right issues. For a long time I thought one had to accept the animal rights, vegan, and certain pagan elements to call one self a furry. It took five years to finally convince myself while I may not agree on every thing one believes in the fandom, the important thing is, what we fans make of it and we can change it and carve out a niche in the fandom to our own liking or concentrate on areas of agreement like art.

I feel I had misread your argument, I decided to make it more generic and remove the word you.

[josh down]

^ awesome man! you have the exact same view on the furry fandom that i have. this 'mate' that i keep having trouble with thinks that all furries dress up in fursuits and 'have some fun' to put it into those words. i have to keep telling him not nbut he's so stubborn and obsessed with putting everything 'not him' down that he won't have any of it. according to him... we're 'on a par with the people who believe that the sun won;t rise tomorow'.

oh well... i hate him lol

and as a response... i can see that some humans were great people. i was admitidly making a sweeping generalisation (and a fair biggy at that lol). i have no response, but i still feel this way.

[Kwan]

I perceive you  are a person who do not believes in the Judaeo Christian religion, or  perhaps a few other religions here  and there, for to you humanity has no value because  there is no one to give  him value.

In order to forestall a religious debate--- 
I hope that we can all agree that one does not have to believe in a Judeo-Christian religion in order to value humanity, and vice versa. 

On topic:
Simba the brandy man, humans don't have a monopoly on being materialistic, selfish, and greedy.   Rather than sitting back & being ashamed of humanity as a whole, maybe you could do something locally that could help humanity improve.  A little bit here & there will do humanity a world of good.

[josh down]

i do... i sold a CD of my own tunes for charity (the british heart foundation) just before christmas. then i doubled whatever the CD out of my own pocket and gave it to the charity. i also do lots of work for the village, and organise lots of the stuff that goes on in school music. i just didn't think that i needed to mention it...

no probs... and like i said, i am making an extreme generalisation. i dare say that i've done a lot more than most others in my age range.

edit...

this is why i don;t like talking about this so much as just hearing what other people have to say. i just end up losing friends or not letting people see the real me. i don;t like bigging myself up like i just did.

[Fen-Fen]

I'm proud to be human. I'd rather be controlled by emotion and the ability to understand those emotions than the instinct that I was born with if I was what Citronne is (Red Pandurr) . The human race is materialistic, sure, but it's a psychological thing. A lot of people who have money now, started with little to no money and are proud of what they have accomplished and made of themselves in the financial category. Even so, if the people who complain about the human race being greedy, most don't even try to correct that stereotype (which is ironic since furries tend to stereotype "hy00mans" and whine about being stereotyped themselves) .

...And Kwan, I lieks my ice cream, too.

[Acton]

I perceive you  are a person who do not believes in the Judaeo Christian religion, or  perhaps a few other religions here  and there, for to you humanity has no value because  there is no one to give  him value.

In order to forestall a religious debate--- 
I hope that we can all agree that one does not have to believe in a Judeo-Christian religion in order to value humanity, and vice versa. 

For the record I could put on my devils advocate hat and argue to same form an Objectivist*  opposition to intrinsic value. This is something has value on it own, for something to have value a person must give it value.
* Objectivist are atheistic in their beliefs. 

[Kumori-kun]

i don;t wanna turn you all into vegetarian pacifists,

I'm already a vegetarian pacifist anyway! ED

For my point of view, I also don't much like humans, but it's not like their all bad. There's quite a few non-furs I know who are very nice people to be around. And I'm sure that somewhere along the line there is a furry who's just as bad as any of those humans you were talking about. We're all different. You can't hate an entire group for the sins of a few.

[TCD]

* Objectivist are atheistic in their beliefs. 

Wrong. Objectivists simply see the world as it is, and if you want to bring Rand into it, they do not let their beliefs (whatever they are) influence the world around them. I'm sure many atheists are objectivists, and many objectivists atheists, but they are not mutually exclusive.

Back on topic:

Sometimes I am not proud of being human. More often times, however, especially when I see those small, random acts of kindness that can sometime change an entire life around, I am extremely proud of being human.

[josh down]

i never wanted this topic to turn into a religious debate... where in my post did i even mention religion, so try and keep it out please... (if i didn't say it, another mod will do)

and...

i don;t wanna turn you all into vegetarian pacifists,

I'm already a vegetarian pacifist anyway! ED

For my point of view, I also don't much like humans, but it's not like their all bad. There's quite a few non-furs I know who are very nice people to be around. And I'm sure that somewhere along the line there is a furry who's just as bad as any of those humans you were talking about. We're all different. You can't hate an entire group for the sins of a few.

i wish i was as rational as you. i jump to conclusions too much. there are rl humans who i do like to be around... but they are all vegetarians too. i'm too closed minded.

[Relaxing Dragon]

Well the thing is (and I hoe this isn't the message I'm getting from my random scans of this thread), it's not like only Furries are the good ones in this world. There's a lot of nice and helpful people out there, and more often than not, they're not Furries (not so much because they don't want to be, but more along the line of there simply not being as many Furries as there are 'regular' people, so it's a statistics thing. And there are irritating/'bad' Furries too). Just pointing that out, apologies if that's not what was being implied (and is, in fact, already well known and thought).

...yeah, that rant didn't make as much sense as it did in my head.

[josh down]

made sense to me lol

[Kaloth]

Call me a romantic, but I think that animals are wiser than humans. They adapt to their environment, while we adapt our environment. I admit that some things we have done are pretty cool, (music, videogames and whatnot.) but the price is nature. I have tried for most of my life to find a forest, a true forest that is more than a mile diameter, and have not been successful. As for the languages I find that animals are more than capable of communicating with each other. If you disagree watch a documentary on a wolf pack. The longer lifespans, look at the tortuous they can live for almost twice what a human can. For the art, and intelligence (Once more extremely romantic ideas) I think that animals have learned to appreciate simplicity. Sure we have art and "intelligence" but all of our intelligence goes to making our life simpler, yet think of how simple it would be if we all lived like animals. Hungry? Go hunt your own food, Tired? Find a safe place to sleep. I think that animals are much smarter than humans, and thus I am not proud to be a human.

My two cents.
~Makir~

[lilfurbal]

I think that animals are much smarter than humans, and thus I am not proud to be a human.

I agree entirely with everything you just said Makir, that is very well put.  In our effort to do all these things to supposedly make our lives easier, it ultimately just made living as a human all the more complicated. 

[Savaaha]

i never wanted this topic to turn into a religious debate... where in my post did i even mention religion, so try and keep it out please... (if i didn't say it, another mod will do)

And this mod is saying so.. Put the brakes on here guys, no more religion here. thanx

[ontels]

yet think of how simple it would be if we all lived like animals. Hungry? Go hunt your own food, Tired? Find a safe place to sleep. I think that animals are much smarter than humans, and thus I am not proud to be a human.

but then we wouldn't be able to talk to each other like were doing now

[Heaven Implode]

but then we wouldn't be able to talk to each other like were doing now

It depends on how you define "talk" actually. Verbal communication is complex, but non-verbal cues are arguably deeper. The phrase "A picture is worth a thousand words" comes to mind.

You might be interested in reading up on the Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis, the idea that how a language works affects how easily you can formulate ideas. It was touched upon in 1984 by George Orwell, and if you think about it, you can hardly deny that there is at least some influence on how language and the way it works encompasses how a society thinks, and in turn how easy it is to think along their lines, and harder to think differently.

[Old Rabbit]

I fear the news media paints a bad picture of humanity more times
than not with War, Terrorism, and crime. Bad news sells unfortunately.

I feel one would find in reality the majority of humanity do good or mind
their own business. Just wanting to live and let live.

It's easy to think the animals live a simple life with only simple needs, but
the law of the jungle so to speak can be very cruel, starvation, sickness, and
death.

 Perhaps it's animation or true life adventure stories that give
a view that many animals have a idealistic life style. They rarely show
the reality of life. Generally it's those on top of the food chain
that have the least to worry. But even those have to find food
often to survive.

The furry fandom is a fun fantasy. To have a world with humanoid
animals of various kinds, and shapes would make for a interesting life
indeed.

But we all have our faults, and we should do what we can to
set a good example for others, and try to help our enviorment .
Perhaps it will make life better for all. Encluding our animal friends.

I will hop off my soapbox now.

Old Rabbit